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July 28, 2009

Defending Jackson's Doctor

Posted: 12:29 AM ET

The Daily Beast’s Gerald Posner on the new allegations that Dr. Conrad Murray administered the fatal injection to the pop star—and why the doctor’s legal team is hoping for an Elvis-like toxicology report.

art.jackson.skin.grammys.gi...The Daily Beast was told by a source familiar with Jackson’s toxicology report that traces of at least six prescription drugs were found in his body. (Craig Harvey, the chief investigator of the Los Angeles Coroner’s Office, did not respond to two calls seeking comment.)

The best hope for the defense team is that the toxicology report is Elvis-like. When the original King of Rock ‘n’ Roll died at the age of 42 in 1977, 10 drugs were found in his body. Four were in “significant” quantities: codeine; Ethinamate, a popular sedative-hypnotic med of the 1970s; Quaaludes; and a barbiturate, or depressant, that has never been identified but is usually reported as Phenobarbital. Presley’s body also contained smaller amounts of the painkillers morphine and Demerol; tranquilizers Placidyl and Valium, and Chlorpheniramine, an antihistamine.

Presley’s body had no traces of his admitted favorite drug, Dilaudid, called the “Bentley of Heroin” on the street and recognized by doctors as between two to eight times more potent than morphine. (Dilaudid was pinpointed as the culprit in the May accidental overdose death of Las Vegas comedian Danny Gans.)

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Filed under: Larry King Live • Michael Jackson


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Toni   July 28th, 2009 12:40 am ET

This is ridiculus. If he had diprivan to sleep, which is to put you completely under, WHY would he need anything else. I knew in the end ,Michael would be blamed for the entire thing. This is sick.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 1:09 am ET

BS! How'd he get all the other drugs? Arn't they alone, a lethal combination? You don't supply an addict with his own Pharmacy!

A Doctor is supposed to monitor the prescriptions, so that the patient doesn't overdose. Not allow for prescription meds, that if combined could be lethal! Its Negligence.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 2:04 am ET

Yeah, if the diprivan killed him,then what were the needle marks on his neck from. Dr.s already said it would be impossible to inject himself. Maybe Murry was trying to cover up the diprivan and make it look like an overdose of other drugs. Why would Michael take something for pain, depression or anxiety, if he was going to be out cold with diprivan. WOW, this is really getting crazy.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 2:10 am ET

What in H do they mean they are hoping for an Elvis like Tox. report? Ain't happening! It is much more than just that and they know it. I got the feeling this guys Attorney is as dumb as he is. Drinkin too much Texas T!

BTW...Checked out that Pain Clinic...The Beverly Hills Pain Institute – How fancy schamancy us is that? Funny thing, it's only 1.9 miles between 'one person's office' there and the home on Carolwood-5 minute drive-Hmmmm...


daisy   July 28th, 2009 2:16 am ET

Addiction is a disease, not a character flaw. Doctor's take an oath,"Do no harm". Regardless of what other drugs MJ had taken, by all accounts propofol should NOT be given at home and must have continuous supervision. Murray was a cardiologist, not an anesthesiologist. Why was he getting paid such big bucks? How did they really meet and who introduced them? The time of death is crucial...how long was murray with mj's body before making that 911 call? He could have injected mj with other drugs to cover the propofol. Who placed the call 2 hours after the 911 call to clean out murray's shed? Why did murray run away and immediately lawyer up? It was common knowledge mj was addicted to pain med,, propofol certainly should never have been given to him. I say Murder #2 and throw away the key.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 3:06 am ET

daisy
Thats what I said. I think maybe the needle marks on his neck were injections to cover up the diprivan. Therefore, Michael will get the sole blame. But I said too, why would Michael need pain, anxiety or antidepressant if he was going to be completely out. What would be the reason? If they find Diprivan or can prove it was given to him, and they also find these other drugs in his system, something is seriously wrong here. You have anesthesia to prevent pain during surgery, so why would Michael need demerol if he was under anesthesia?


cly   July 28th, 2009 3:40 am ET

murray fell asleep.


cly   July 28th, 2009 3:47 am ET

do you think debbie have ever thought about the weight and reponsibility of raising a jackson child. Katherene and joe have raised 9 I think they have a solid grip on what it takes to deal with the papa


Lori   July 28th, 2009 4:00 am ET

TMZ is reporting that Dr. Murray admitted to law enforcement that he gave Michael the propofil IV drip.

We need the tox screen. I hope someone gets nailed for this. This is just so wrong on so many levals. Michael did not have to die.


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:31 am ET

Toni
I don't know how long other drugs such as antidepressants and anti-anxity or demerol stay in the system. I know diprivan doesn't stay very long. Mj could have taken the other pills earlier in the day before he was given the diprivant to sleep. Murray will say it was the combination of all the drugs mixed together, not just the diprivan, putting some of the blame on mj.
I think mj hired murray just for the diprivan. He needed it to sleep for this tour. He asked Cheri-lyn first, maybe she suggested he call murray. Funny how both Cheri lynn and murray said they met mj while treating his kids. That's fishy to me. I felt tonight she was trying to pin it all on murray. Murray had a supplier of dirivan and who knows what else. These docs are nothing more than drug dealers.If mj really was looking for a doc to take care of his health, he would have hired a doctor with impressive credentials from a respectable top notch medical school, but instead he hired murray, someone with a sketchy past. I bet he wouldn't even trust him to treat his kids.


BRITTNEY CARROLL   July 28th, 2009 4:59 am ET

i am sorry for their lost and hope the best for then the Jackson family


helena   July 28th, 2009 5:23 am ET

They all wish this looked like Elvis's death, this is nothing compared to Elvis. Michael was given the drug for one reason, to kill him. all this crap coming from everyones mouth is silly. Where is the so-call Dr now. why all the hiding, why destroy all evidence why perform wrongfull CPR to cover your attempt. WE WANT THE TRUTH AND JUSTICE!!!!!!! Dr Murray had a dark past was this a way out!!! all 19 doctors should be banned and locked up and throw the key away!! It was done to MJ who we all know how many more people did these doctors wipe out we do not know....all for greed for money.


helena   July 28th, 2009 5:43 am ET

Dr Murray is guilty intentionally of unintentionally. Lawyers get paid to clear their clients name. Dr murray, Dr Klein, 19 doctors and his Lawyers are all after money. If they wanted to actually help Michael he would be alive.


helena   July 28th, 2009 5:46 am ET

Watching CNN breaking news now, Please do not put theses lawyers to air they do not know what they say or do they get paid to defend their client Murray.


Lisa   July 28th, 2009 5:51 am ET

Maybe this doctor gave him the final shot but you must ask your self why Michael was so depressed and had such sleeping problems.
A life of bullying, a life of being ridiculed on first page on tabloids, a life of being made fun or everywhere, breaks you down.

Especially when all you want to do and do is to make people happy. The dying started years ago but the deepest cut was made by Martin Bashir.


stu   July 28th, 2009 6:16 am ET

Now all is about dr Murey only.Wath about,if Murey was vorking for AMG.Are thay not looking for that at all?
I think who ever give in the Diprivan injaction,still,its the dr gilt to give MJ Diprivan in any whay.I think,in this show was peaples,who will looking for the trouth and try to pruve it.


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 6:29 am ET

I think we all have to face the reality: MJ was an addict, maybe on the way to, again another, withdrawl attempt, but an addict anyhow. Considering Farrakhan's speech which is still lingering in my ears, it is understandable it came to that point.

Dr. Murray, if the rumours are true, should be hold accountable, for he did not monitor MJ in the proper way, outside this hospital setting.

I still believe there were 2 sides in MJ. I believe Lisa Marie when she said that when things went bad, it really went BAD. MJ profiled also another aspect of an addict: he manipulated the people around him.

The question is, did he come to a point he was no longer sane enough to decide for himself. I tend to believe he was over the edge and ripe for not only a drug clinic but also phsychiatric institution. HE NEEDED HELP!!

Where were the people that were supposed to help him? You don't help addicts by giving in to their threats. So, AMG/SONY have also a lot of explaining to do. They wanted their interests to be served. We know what their interest was.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 7:22 am ET

Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel

They was not going to help Michael, because if they was stealing his mone you want to be able to control them to a certain point. If you are high on anything the more vulnerable you are


Jessica   July 28th, 2009 7:23 am ET

Michael Jackson was an addict period! There is no one to blame but Michael Jackson but addicts can't help themselves. This is their disease, they are sick and out of control. Dr Murray is to blame because he abused his code of ethics. He let himself be manipulated by MJ because he was star struck and wanted to associate himself with a celebrity and it back fired on him. I believe that Dr Murray didnot intentionally give MJ an overdose of Diprivan but if he was suppose to be monitoring the IV infusion of Diprivan he did a poor job, probably fell asleep while doing it. He should be charged for being reckless and doing something illegal. I am sure that no one could say no to Michael Jackson.. Anyone that said no would be fired or dropped like a hot pancake by MJ. These doctors all used MJ but MJ used these doctors too. MJ was a person who would not take no for an answer. It is so so sad and if you ask me MJ committed suicide. He started committing suicide a long time ago when he started taking a mixture of these pain killers and sedatives and even if he wanted to stop it would have been near to impossible because he was hooked. Some of you are in denial when you say why would he be taking pain killers if he was going to sleep on Diprivin he wouldn't need pain killers. You're wrong!!! He took the pain killers not only because it made him high but because he was hooked and if he stopped he would even suffer more pain from withdrawal symptoms. That is how it works. When an addict start having withdrawal symptoms they suffer with worse pain, become nauseated, vomits, have diarrhea and severe stomach pain and feel like they are dying. Their blood pressure soars high and they can have a stroke when they are withdrawing. He was hooked!!! Stop blaming, open your eyes. Maybe something good will come out of this such as doctors will stop making their patients addicts by giving them pain pills liberally when they are not in pain. Maybe these celebraties will open their eyes and will stop acting like the world owes them something. Joe Jackson didnot cause Michael Jackson to become an addict. The Pepsi burn didnot cause MJ to become an addict. He became an addict because he liked the way it felt when he took the pills. It not only made him feel high but the diet pills gave him lots of energy to dance all over the stage. I am a true testament of pain killers, diet pills and sedatives so I know what I'm talking about. It wasn't easy but I got clean and sober, why, because I loved life too much and I loved my kids more than I loved drugs. So stop blaming everybody. The blame starts with Michael Jackson who was out of control period!


Jessica   July 28th, 2009 7:34 am ET

Stu Now all is about dr Murey only.Wath about,if Murey was vorking for AMG.Are thay not looking for that at all?

Stu....enough about Dr Murray working for AEG. AEG hired Dr Murray because Michael Jackson told AEG he needed to have this Dr Murray hired by them. They knew nothing of this doctor. MJ knew he could manipulate Dr Murray for drugs so this is why he wanted him as a doctor.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 8:03 am ET

Jessica

Please with that. Sure Michael takes some of the blame but not all of it. The man wanted to sleep and can you blame him? Have you ever suffered 3 rd degree burns to your scalp if not you dont know what he was feeling. AEG was involved whether you admit it or not. Dr. Murray was not star struck he was money strucked just like everyone else involved in this scenario. And just because a patient ask for meds does not mean you will get it and Doctors should know better plain and simple, especially knowing your license and career is on the line. And his drugs was more powerful than a normal addict and not everyone is the same.


Rich Miller   July 28th, 2009 8:03 am ET

With all due respect to Cherilyn Lee, RN, Michael Jackson's nurse, Ms. Lee is not a "nutritionist" as reported on Larry King Live last night.
A "nutritionist" is a person who is specifically trained in foods and nutrition and has earned a college degree in those areas and who has passed a national exam given by the American Dietetic Association earning the "Registered Dietitian, R.D. designation. In most cases, nurses only complete one course in nutrition as part of their training. It would be better to describe her as Michael Jackson's nurse who guided him in making healthy choices regarding his diet.


Adrienne   July 28th, 2009 8:03 am ET

How dare you compare ELVIS and MJ. There is no comparion. MJ was murdered plain and simple. I hope that the LAPD doesn't hind behind some fallacy that media has portrayed MJ as a drug addict. He will killed by Dr. Murray, even someone with half a brain can figure that out. With the help of Dr. Klein and all the other doctors. And don't forget AEG and Sony. I think that Dr. Murray needs to hope for a better defense. I wonder who was the one who called Mark Geragos to defend them. STUPID!


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 8:07 am ET

The only thing I blame Michael for is trusting everyone. He put his life in the hands of shady characters. And of course he wanted to live thats why his doctor was suppose to watch over him. And who could blame him for wanting to sleep, look at the time and energy he put into performing for us. That is not an easy task.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 8:08 am ET

Heck no, Elvis was no where near Michael Jackson's level. So the comparisons need to stop.


Mary U from Ohio   July 28th, 2009 8:15 am ET

Just cause they asked for a toxicology report don't mean a thing. They just want to be sure that something else didn't kill him...You know Food Poisoning is a Toxin.. Many things can be toxin...
And even if Prescription Drugs are what killed him..... So what...

Now everyone wants to help put Dr's away and get the for murder... When Michael was Found not Guilty of all Charges. Why won't the accusers put in Jail and that Chief on LAPD... The were Killing him then... Every Day I watched the Trial Michael was getting weaker and weaker... People were running him down Media wouldn't stop Bashing... Now you say you want justice... The same people and Media that ran him to the Ground... Hypocrites.. What gives you a voice..Don't you think GOD know what your doing... You are phony.. Acting like you care about Michael..
The same Media and non Michael Fans Calling him a Freak, Say that the fans want to know about Michael's Face... Idiots... Don't count me in on that one...
I didn't think anything on Michael Looks... I thought every year Michael got better and better looking... Gorgeous

You know What.. Your Jealous of Michael...Cause people were Crazy over Him... Come on Media keep throwing another one.


Lisa   July 28th, 2009 8:16 am ET

Again, I want you to think about WHY Michael was so depressed and why he needed medication to get some peace in his mind.

I dont think he took that much drugs in his life in general, i think the big thing started in 2003, after the Bashir interview and the accusations.

I also think about the words that Leonard Rowe said "why do a person who is in perfect health need a 24/7 doctor?" There was more to Michael Jacksons health than the dependence on drugs, trust me, but we will probably never know exactly.

Murray will be the scapegoat but his intention can never have been to kill michael jackson. There were others that wanted michael out of this world.

It is all so sad that a person that gave us so much, comforted so many young people with his music during their lonely times, always had a song you could listen to when you needed support, was so depressed and sad that nothing could save him.


Malaika Afrika   July 28th, 2009 8:29 am ET

Murray is surely goin to jail, it took him 45mins to col 911, he hired a lawyer hours after Michael's death, he disappeared hours after MJ was taken to hospital..... for christsake this Murray is as guilty as HELL!!!


Patty Anderson   July 28th, 2009 8:59 am ET

There is absolutely no comparison. micheal was his own person. Nothing like Elvis


stu   July 28th, 2009 9:11 am ET

Jessica.
We dont know,how thay hired hem,only we know,wath thay say.There is something very strange about the inshourance for the koncerts.If the ambulance didnt see for 10 minutes,it was hem,couse he looked so old,thann how he want true of that tests?Something is very wrong about this.


stu   July 28th, 2009 9:12 am ET

I personaly woukld love,that the police would put in gal the Chandlers and the other ones who said,he was molestateing the kid.Everything bad started thann.


stu   July 28th, 2009 9:23 am ET

I am very curios,wats gonna hapening after thay gat the toxicologik result.If demerol is in MJ sistem,thann is it gonna be 2.re murder,or if its not in the sistem,thann thay have other evidences,and can prouve something,and thann 2-re murder,or manslauther,or jus he gat avay.I cant wait.


Mara   July 28th, 2009 10:34 am ET

This is all so depressing. He needs to be in jail. All of them who contributed to this need to be in jail.


Lori   July 28th, 2009 10:41 am ET

Let's think about this.....no matter how it happened, Dr. Murray ended up on AEG payroll under contract to care for MJ 24/7 for the sum of $150,000/month plus expenses. Obviously AEG expected Dr. M to take extrodinary measures to protect their star. OK so wouldn't you be able to go after AEG in a civil case since their employee did not do his job and allowed MJ to die? Didn't AEG have a duty to completely check out Dr. M and confirm his qualifications?

If MJ was the "addict" that everyone seems the thinks – why would AEG make such a huge investment in producing the THIS IS IT show? They'd already spent millions. Shouldn't they have checked out everyone involved in the show? What did AEG know?


Mara   July 28th, 2009 10:46 am ET

Amen to that Lori!


Mary U from Ohio   July 28th, 2009 10:50 am ET

Did They ever Check out if The boy in 1993 and Gaven in 2005 really had Cancer????? Their's one for you Media. Check that one out..


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 10:51 am ET

@Lisa,

MJ already took a doctor with him on his History tour in 1997-1998 and was administered propofol. It did not start with Bashir.

@Jacquelyn, to me it is hard to believe there has been NO doctor at all that would profess with integrity. They should have taken MJ out of the Hollywood scene and bring him in a, probably dull, but more safe and seclusive setting.


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 10:52 am ET

Hey Guys–Jacquelyn–set up WeloveMichaelJackson blog on yahoo group–That's where we need to go.– I've had enough of CNN and the so called experts that have coming on –Still exploiting Michael.


Mara   July 28th, 2009 10:56 am ET

Linda

what is the web address


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 11:05 am ET

Yahoo groups–WeloveMichaelJackson-


stu   July 28th, 2009 11:08 am ET

Yes lori!
Pluss,lets say,MJ was finde dr Murey for hem self,not AMG,and even,if dr Murey didnt kill MJ by AMG order,it was (etlist the lost shot) only dr Murey fault,thann dont AMG is still responzible for MJ was in bad helth,and push hem to do this turne,and whenn he felt bad lost day,thay still pushed hem,and thats why he didnt go to hospital?And thay are not responzible of this inshourance,that probeble there was som chiting with it,couse if MJ was look,like 80 years old man,he was not in good inough helt for this turne.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 11:20 am ET

Well, if they are trying to say once again Michael was an addict-Think...He has a Doctor who had to have known if not by Michael, then by association with Dr. Klein, there was a problem in the past and obviously Michael sought help and got treatment for that. It's almost like if you knew a suicidial person was intent on doing harm, Would you supply a gun and hand it to him in your capacity as a Doctor? Didn't think so.

With that said...I am wondering now if those needle marks on the neck had something to do with Demerol and the idea that Michael 'had a migraine' in order to cover up for that Diprivan-Cannot imagine this, but then again look what is going on and on our 1st news reports that is what the Dr said, he gave Demerol. The pills in Michael's stomach also were not fully dissapated. somehow that almost screams of enabling, when you stop and think where the Rx's were located-In Dr, Murrays bedroom closet-It almost sounds to me, they were given before the IV.

I'll share 1 experience. I was scheduled for a procedure in a hospital where the Dr's there told me they were going to place an IV into my neck to check for possible blockage in that area due to these migraines I have( at the time, they thought it was something other than migraines). When the appointed time came, I kept questioning this, mainly because of the iodine compound they were going to use for contrast..The head Dr. said They would NEVER use an IV in the neck area, way too dangerous...there you have it.


mariau   July 28th, 2009 11:35 am ET

i just think media were blind behind all this... what we really don't understand that, still you are trying to speculate that Michael's death is own fault.. maybe it was, if he never hired a doctor like murray..
it's too obvious people that, giving shades to murray, so no one could ever blamed.. except Michael.. he himself ... this is what they want to reveal.. that michael jackson is junky.. so all his fans around the world should stop honoring.. i cry because media was too oppressive to Michael for almost 35 years of his life.. i cry because i really dont understand why media and others so harsh with him..
please.. people .. just open your eyes and your mind, i hope i wont happen this to you, what happened to michael, i hope it wont to you..
did think somehow why mj too depress ... because of you and the tabloids.. did you ever listen to him, did you ever open your mind to him.. at least give him justice.. and if will tell us, murray is just scape goat. do you think people will buy that.. oooohh please dont be prejudice.. "Prejudice is ignorance"..


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 11:38 am ET

PS: Do Not care what excuse this Dr. gives. Let's not forget, this Doctor did NOT have the rights to give anything to anybody-Not Licensed to write an Rx in California, so therefore, not Licensed to hand out anything either. so then the question is..Who is the Dr. that filled those Rx's. could not have been the Dr, Unless he had them shipped from Houston-Hello FedEx. Still no excuse, could NOT give them, and that drug, once again should NOT be in a house at all!

I had another thought today about AEG. As maybe some of you know, the are surrounding Staples Center is as we speak being built by-AEG. Wonder if they needed more money to complete the work. times are tough right now...thats all I'll say on that.


Mary U from Ohio   July 28th, 2009 11:44 am ET

Did AEG people that was with Michael on Stage say they seen Needle Marks on Michael's neck and arms??????


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 11:55 am ET

If you guys go the The blog that Jacquelyn set up–Use yourname from here on any post. I think people are signing up but don't recognize any of the names


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 12:02 pm ET

Mary U.

The ones who talked, said he appeared to be fine, in good shape. then...AEG quickly signed them all to confidentiality agreements-Everyone-From the dancers, to the janitor. strange, isn't it?


Kats Meow   July 28th, 2009 12:13 pm ET

Ha Ha and Ha! Comparing this dire situation to Elvis is like saying Michael died exactly like Elvis, .they need to get the facts straight. Elvis had enough Cholesterol in his system, was impacted, was obesely overweight and died of heart problems. True, he had some drugs in his system, but he did not have a Doctor in his care 24/7 like Michael did and he never had remnants of any Anesthesia in him either. Where'd this dumb lawyer get his degree? Box of Cracker Jacks? T


Julie   July 28th, 2009 12:43 pm ET

Sorry, just reading back through everyone's posts, so I am behind!

To mariau,

I understand how you feel. I have been asking why!

Why did this happen to Michael?
Why did the media not relent?
Why do people lie and make up stories?
Why is money more important then someones life?
Why didn't Michael like a better life?
And why did it take Michael to die, before people would come out and show they love him?

Then I purchased the Live in Bucharest tour, and watched the performance of Human Nature! He looks strait into the camera, and tells you why! Very strangely, I felt that Michael was answering my question.

Everyone should find the performance on Youtube.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 12:56 pm ET

Also, with regards to Dr. Murray, and Cherilyn Lee, both may have treated Michael's kids, but Michael may have used his kids as an excuse to get doctors in the door so he could get his pain meds.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 1:00 pm ET

I've got the concert video, but I just haven't been able to bring myself to watch it yet. I'll wait until my family is gone so I'm free to cry if I need to.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 1:03 pm ET

I balled when I watched it!


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 1:19 pm ET

I thought everyone would be on Jacquelyn's blog–
I Iove the Bucharest concert Video. I cried too. He was so full of lie.


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 1:21 pm ET

That video is part of the Essential Michael Jackson collection. You guys have it right?


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 1:21 pm ET

Re:Bucharest Video–I meant full of Life.


Rose   July 28th, 2009 1:21 pm ET

Elisheva: I wrote a response to you under the earlier blog: Revolting Revelation, MJ not allowed burial etc. Please read it.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 1:57 pm ET

Linda
I have to go to work in a while, but I will hopefully find you all on Js blog tonight. If I don't get there, come look for me, I'll probably be lost.I tried to find you guys for 2hrs last night. Apparently I was in the right place, but didn't recognize the names, so I didn't chat.


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 2:06 pm ET

Rose, I gave you an anwer. I don't talk to sharia appeasers and people that hate zionists.

From now on our discussion is closed.

Shalom!


Lynn   July 28th, 2009 2:19 pm ET

What is the site for the new blog of jacquelyns? I tried once but couldn't find it.


Rose   July 28th, 2009 2:21 pm ET

Elisheva: I was responding to your comment about West Africa. I think something is quite wrong with you as you are reducing it to sharia appeasers (!!!) – what does that have to do with the history of the slaves of West Africa? You lack logic. You obviously didn't bother to read what I wrote, or you would not have responded in such an ignorant matter.

Perhaps if you were not so ignorant about history, you would not get my rebuttals. Not continuing our discussion is no loss for me, I prefer to converse with intelligent, knowledgeable people who don't have complexes about their political beliefs and then accuse others of stupid things. I don't support any religion. I think it's a delusion. But I am aware of history (not propaganda to justify oppressing others) and cannot deny atrocities committed against people.


daisy   July 28th, 2009 2:21 pm ET

I think staying on this blog is good because we are read and perhaps can get our point of view across. We ask questions that need to be answered.


Rose   July 28th, 2009 2:25 pm ET

Elisheva: Also, just because a person speaks up against the wrongs committed by "any" group doesn't make them automatically hate the wrong-doers. It makes them question their actions. Are you mature enough to understand the difference? You just labelled me based on your own prejudices. It's a reflection on your insecurites, not what I wrote. I'm more than happy to not waste anymore of my time on someone who cannot bother to read.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 2:27 pm ET

daisy

No body said it wasnt good. But like another poster said we have to be careful what is said on here.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 2:29 pm ET

Jacquelyn,
yeah I was there, just din't recognize anyone. Now tonight I'll have to rejoin because I left it.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 2:31 pm ET

Toni

Np, i am still trying to get the hang of it so no worries.:)


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 2:39 pm ET

Rose, gimme a break. It is obvious what you want from me as a zionist. Forget it, it's not going to happen. Even my Palestinian friends, and I have plenty, laugh about it. If I say A, you say B. Sure.

As we say in Israel, usually in Arabic: YALLA!

End of discussion. I am focusing on the positive and kind people here.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 2:41 pm ET

Jacquelyn
Go to my theory on the LKL last nite blob.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 2:42 pm ET

I don't know what you two are arguing about, but this forum is about Michael Jackson and what has happened to him!


Rose   July 28th, 2009 2:45 pm ET

Elisheva: What do I want from you!?! You are nuts. What's not going to happen? I don't know what yalla means – so what's the point in writing it. You realize I'm in the US not in Israel. Go ahead and focus on other people, the ones who automatically call others "haters" – your kind of positive people. See a therapist while you're at it – that's what we do in the US when we're delusional.


daisy   July 28th, 2009 2:49 pm ET

OC lady
Unfortunately this doctor was licensed to practice in California therefore he could write RXs.
But, he was not an anesthesiologist and it is a mystery where he was able to get hold of diprivan.


Lisa   July 28th, 2009 2:56 pm ET

Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel:

I dont think you have followed Micheael close enough if you dont see the difference between before and after 2003.

The Michael you see on the history tour is a totally different Micheael, physically and mentally. I understand that with the dancestyle he had was a tremendus preassure for the body. I dance my self and know that as a dancer you are always having pain somewhere in the body.
He was taking medication and drugs to kill physical pain but to take pills for depression and anxistty (or how that word is spelled) is something else. Look at the footage from the trials, he looks so sad and there is one clip when he cries. You can compare the glow in his eyes, the energy his body language sends out BEFORE 2000 and after. It is a huge difference.

He knew that this was the last thing he was doing. He knew that his body was finished.

It is easy to remember that he was only 50 becasue he had been around for so many years, but 50 is not THAT old. Diana Ross looks more vital than he did and she has delievered 6 children.

I think that he died from an overdose but I think that the drugs and medication, that he at some point started to take and later got addicted to, was for an illness unknow to us.

And to Rose and Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel:

Please keep religion out of this. Michale wanted to break down barriers and look for similarities instead of looking for differences. Lets try our best to try a little harder to understand each other instead.

"Before you judge me, try hard to understand me"


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 2:59 pm ET

That's my final word on your accusation toward Israeli's like me.

I wonder if your fellow posters here will appreciate it you calling them "haters".

These so called haters love MJ and are here to come to terms with the fact he died and with the way his life has been the past decade.


Lynn   July 28th, 2009 3:00 pm ET

Hey Rose,

Why dont you give it up already or start a new blog for it. This is about MJ.


Cocovelvet   July 28th, 2009 3:01 pm ET

AaaHaaaaa!!!! Do they now want to start making an excuse that the concoction of medications is the reason for MJ's death???

No ways pals, because the main issue here is THE PRESENCE OF PROPOFOL WHICH WAS FOUND AT MJ'S HOUSE AND HOW IT ENDED UP THERE ; WHO SUPPLIED OR BROUGHT IT THERE AND WHO FINALLY COULD HAVE ADMINISTERED IT TO MJ.

If the propofol is already found in MJ's body as reports say, then it was ofcourse administered probably after the other medications were taken by MJ and as such trickered the cardiac arrest which led to MJ's death. As was explained by one of the guests at LKL last night about the effects of propofol, the drug is ofcourse dangerous and become even more lethal when administered in addition to other drugs.

SO; THE ISSUE HERE SHOULD NOT BE WHETHER MJ HAD A CONCOCTION OF MEDICATIONS ON HIS BODY; BUT WHO PROVIDED AND ADMINISTERED SUCH A DANGEROUS AND UNAUTHORISED DRUG (outside hospital) TO MJ??!!

You can start counting your days before you see the entrance of a court room Sir Murray........


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 3:06 pm ET

@Lisa, have you read Jamie Lee Curtius' column in The Huffington Post? I think she hit the jackpot with her analysis. The decay started before 2003, though Bashir was probably the final knock down.

I also think his body was at the end. No wonder with all these pills and the emotional stress. He should have been protected against himself. Efforts were made but not enough. I think many people, also those we will never see, will scratch behind their ears they did not so enough persistently.

As for Rose, it is basically not about religion, if you followed our dispute from the beginning, it is clear she attacked me for being an Israeli aka zionist occupier.


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 28th, 2009 3:10 pm ET

As I mentioned it here yesterday, due to some sporadic episodes of atrial fibrillation, I was administered propofol for a couple of cardioversions. To me it is beyond comprehension that any doctor would give this on a regular base, outside a clinical setting, without EKG and oxygen meter, and for hours in a row.

Why didn't they give him a dormicum? Also a swift rush but practically without danger. Also a REM-sleep and the proper thing for a good night sleep.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 3:13 pm ET

Elisheva
Don't worry, we'll defend you, we're starting to get pretty good at this.

For people that are not here to support Michael,
If you don't want to get bombarded with people that love and want to defend Michael, then don't come here. If you do, then lets just agree to disagree. Don't demean someones religion if you do not know that person.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 3:13 pm ET

Hi Daisy...I'm sorry, but he is licenseed as a Dr. in CA. but does not have any rights to write any Rx's here-The thing is He admitted he gave this drug to Michael and he is Not qualified to do so-not here, not Houston, not Las Vegas, not Hawaii...No place

Hey...BTW...where's Annie from Vegas? Did you shoot that hole in one, Annie 😉 Seems other people went for a Tee Off time as Well 🙂

BINGO..No...I Mean FORE!!!!!!and watch those smoking Divots!


Julie   July 28th, 2009 3:37 pm ET

A F@#$ing doctor, "should" have been able to save Michael from himself. Should know signs of addiction, and should be able to say he was a danger to himself!


Lynn   July 28th, 2009 3:51 pm ET

What i want to know is

WHY ISN'T DR MURRAY WEARING HIS NEW SILVER BRACELETS ALREADY????


Lisa   July 28th, 2009 4:19 pm ET

Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel:

That was what I said, the deepest cut was with the Bashir documentary and all that followed.

Jamie Lee Curtis was a different case.


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:24 pm ET

Rose,
Shame on you! You are not only ignorant but a hater.
How dare you!. We don't need this here on this blog.


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:27 pm ET

Oc Lady, if you are correct on that (which I hope you are) murray is in really deep water. Why then would mj even hire him?


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:29 pm ET

Also, you have to question Lou Ferrigno, who was training mj for months? Was he really "fit as a fiddle?"


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:31 pm ET

I don't understand how you could be allowed to practice medicine in a state and not be allowed to write RX in that state. OCLady-


Jen   July 28th, 2009 4:39 pm ET

Mary u from ohio.......

On the NET there is a newspaper columnist who writes to the public things of interest. The 2005 Gavin Arviso's case was all about money when Janet Arviso, Gavin's mother sent the columnist a letter telling her he was dying of cancer. She collected funds from her readers to help Gavin's family then found out that Gavin did not have cancer and that this was a scam Janet Arviso. I can't remember the name of the columnist.


Linda from New York   July 28th, 2009 4:43 pm ET

Toni–We're all on Jacquelyun's blog–I suggested that after you join–reply to something, at the end of your reply–put in your name from here that way we know wwho you are


daisy   July 28th, 2009 4:48 pm ET

Maybe Janet has Munchhausen's Disease, where parents lie about their child's illnesses for attention. If she would lie about him having cancer, it proves she would lie about anything, even molestation, NOT for the money necessarily, but for the attention.


Toni   July 28th, 2009 4:53 pm ET

Linda
gotcha. wish me luck getting there. If I do ,it will be a proud moment in my life. LOL


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 4:55 pm ET

Hi Daisy,
I think to dispense a drug, depending where you are at, you need to fill out or have qualifications in that specific state. Granted, his main operation is either Houston or Vegas, but all these other offices seem to me to be a business for him, in which he hires other Doctors or is alfilliated, something like Networking, to take a % off of those Doctors without ever having to work. He could have also been reprimanded prior to this in CA. as well. As for that Diptrivan, he had no right to even have it at his disposal, even if he did a procedure in an office enviroment. He's in deep doo doo just on that point alone. I knew of a highly respected Dr. who got reprimanded down to a Worker's Comp. type of Dr. and he could no longer dispense anything, just do physicals.

Linda...I'll join up on J's site in a bit...


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 5:04 pm ET

Funny you should mention Lou Feriggno, Daisy. He was just at a Hollywood Celebrity Shwo in Burbank a couple of weekends ago and it seemed EVERYBODY went up to him to get information on Michael (it's one of those meet and greets where you walk right up, say Hello, if you want a picture, you pay and so forth). Trust me, the man was inundated! He finally got up and took a long break, when he came back, a sign saying no questions about M. Jackson, please, said it all. He was there to promote his new book .

Just now, according to one of our news stations that reliable person who keeps sending out bits of info now says, Diptrivan is the main drug at the heart of the Coroners investigation...


MIMI   July 28th, 2009 5:04 pm ET

RE:JESSICA... ARE U SAYING MEDICATIONS HELPED MICHEAL PERFORM ON STAGE?


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 5:27 pm ET

PS: Sorry...I asked my husband about this medical/Dr/license stuff and he says, unless this guy also took Pharmacology in California, he would have no rigths in the State of CA. to dispense anything. If he was this Cardiologist and had a patient who needed help, he would certainly look to another Doctor such as an Internist with which drugs mix, which ones don't for the benefit of his patients. His speciality is the heart, my husband says, among other things, no way he should have ever used this on anyone, let alone a person in a home without filing paperwork with the State, which would be turned down. He did a Big Wrong here. Makes no difference in general that somebody passed or not, he had no right and niether did any other Dr. who claims to have ever used it on Michael for any other purpose than for procedure. This is not a sleep aid drug, this is a surgery type drug. So, I guess Muraay has lost his license now forever just on that alone, he made the staement, he cannot take it back. His career is over...now I want to see how long he is put away for and who else goes down with the ship.


Cocovelvet   July 28th, 2009 6:49 pm ET

....exactly LYNN. I think its time up Murray receives his long awaited crediantials of the "SILVER BRACELETS" and he can then go proudly and parade them in the courtroom.


Dirty Diana   July 28th, 2009 9:45 pm ET

I don't think mj would have employed murray if he couldn't dispense any medications in Ca. That was the only reason he hired him in the first place. Dirivan aside, because that should never be administered in a home setting under any circumstance. I do think mj needed medication to help him perform for energy, and to help reduce his anxiety. He seems a bit out of it during the Bashir interviews and many other interviews and appearances in recent years. Just watch the court trial...you can see his decline from day to day. He needed rehab so badly and at least one, highly ethical and competent doctor.He never had one.


Jacquelyn   July 28th, 2009 9:51 pm ET

He was also probably tired too. Michael has been working non-stop. Now the interview with Bashir that Michael recorded with Maury he seem fine to me. I will watch it again tonight.


Daisy   July 28th, 2009 10:12 pm ET

I was thinking about mj's last 10 years...and I don't think I have seen him smile in about that time. His beautiful smile disappeared years ago.


Rhonda   July 28th, 2009 10:45 pm ET

Ya'll really need to do some more research. Dr. Murray was hired by AEG and Sony. He was recommended by one of Michael's old employees. Yes Michael had a drug addiction at one time. When he had 3rd degree burns to his scalp after the pepsi commercial. Now think back after that incident as to what happened to Michael. 1984 burnt bad from fire, between 1986/87 diagnosed with vitilago, not sure on what date these other happened. Michael feel twice on stage and broke his nose. Feel off the stage and broke his back. Then diagnosed with insomnia and a bone disorder and then with lupus So now you have Michael taking medication for vitilago, lupus, scalp burns (which they were still trying to fix) insomnia, bone disorder and a messed up back. Now also take it to point that everytime Michael would go to the doctor, they would make him get a second opinion so now you different doctors giving different medications and they are giving him 2 or 3 at a time. Also remember that Michael did not have control over his meds, they were monitored by someone in the house. He knew that he had a problem so he made it to where he could not get to the medicine on his own. If you watch some of his interviews, he asking a lady what time is it cause he is hurting. She had to go and get his meds for him. Michael was an angel sent to us and we so enjoyed having him here or at least some of us did. He was NOT A CHILD MOLESTOR OR A DRUG ADDICT. Michael was in alot of pain. Not only from his medical reasons but from people making fun of him and always printing bad things about him. God finally said well, I gave you something good and you are destroying it so I am taking it back. Rest in peace Michael. You are truly loved and missed. You know also I wish that sometimes the celebrities would trust some of their fans sometimes, cause sometimes it takes a stranger looking in to see what is really going on. I would have gladly given Michael a place to escape to if that is what he needed. Someone to just talk to , play games with, cry with and love him. That is what Michael really wanted. He just wanted to be loved.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 10:48 pm ET

Michael Jackson has some private home movies on youtube, that he made, and hes having some good laughs. It was nice to see.

As for Lou Feriggno, I think the guy is full of BS. Perhaps he worked with Michael on a couple of occasions, but not to the extent he claimed. It makes sense now that someone said he was promoting a new book, I think he came forward to get attention!

In Martin Bashirs interview, he seemed very elated and a little goofy, then after Michael hung his child out the window, and Martin continued the interview in Jan, Michael had changed, was very agitated and cautious. Could be the drugs, could be mood swings. But you could notice a big change in his personality.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 10:54 pm ET

Rhonda,

Michael was addicted to drugs. No one is calling him a drug addict, in a derogatory way. But it is a fact that he relied heavily on his meds. I wouldn't doubt that he was a bit of a hypochondriac. I do believe that he had lupus and vitilago. But many times, he would use an ilness or injury as an excuse.

Asking the nurse for pain meds when he decided it was time, is not control, its a spoiled superstar getting his way. I loved Michael, and am not being mean, but he got his way, and people didn't say no to him.


Mara   July 28th, 2009 10:54 pm ET

Maybe his mood changed because he realized what a mistake he made allowing Bashir to interview him.
Bashir is a snake pretending to do a fair interview when all the time he had plans to betray Michael.
Watch Maury Povich's review of Martin's interview it will make sense then.
Martin Bashir is a no good somebody.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 10:57 pm ET

I am in complete agreement with you, RE Bashir. I watched Maurys interview, before I even watched Bashirs. Michael didn't know what Bashir was doing, until the interview aired.

I believe that he caught some flack for dangling Blanket, and perhaps has mood disorders as well. he was taking meds for depression.


Mara   July 28th, 2009 11:02 pm ET

Yes and he kept asking Michael over and over about his face and how it changed over the years and MJ told him to stop it.


simba   July 28th, 2009 11:09 pm ET

"Asking the nurse for pain meds when he decided it was time, is not control, its a spoiled superstar getting his way. "

Julie, what is wrong with anyone, "spoiled superstar" or not, wanting relief from pain? Rhonda did an excellent job of describing MJ's physical trials. Most people with that much illness would be rolled into a ball, unable to function at all. But Michael Jackson carried on a superstar career, despite the pain.

He did not go out in the streets looking to get high. Doctors never properly managed his pain, and they prescribed ineffective, addictive medications, in dosages far too high for someone of his low body weight. The medical profession failed MJ.


Julie   July 28th, 2009 11:17 pm ET

As I said, Michael being addicted to these pain meds, doesn't make him a "drug addict", as though he had a heroine problem. But the more pain meds you take, the more you need each time for it to work. You build a tolerance to them, so he was taking more and more.

It is the fine line, to becoming an addict. If I lived the life he did, with the emotional scarring he had, I would enjoy the pain medications too, if they took away my emotional pain as well as my physical pain. But saying Michael didn't have a problem, and that he is not an addict, is in a way, enabling his problem. Excusing it. It would have been nice if he realized it himself, for the sake of his children. And honestly, I believe he probably did, but was too far down that spiral, to stop.

Dr Murray, on the other hand, enabled him, took money for his bad doctoring, and never did anything about the addictions he enabled, because he would lose his golden ticket!


Rhonda   July 28th, 2009 11:17 pm ET

Julie,
I wasn't saying everyone in here was calling him an addict. I was saying that a lot of people are saying he was an addict. I agree at one time he was. But he sought help for that. Like I said, if you watch some of his interviews, he is asking what time it is cause he is in pain and someone had to go and get his meds. He didn't go and get them himself. I understand that he relied a lot on medicine. But you also have to realize what medical issues he was having too. Lupus is a deadly disease and very hard to cope with. I know this for a fact cause my best friend died from it and I saw what she had to go through. It is not a pretty sight. It makes you very depressed, you look different at yourself and what other people say about you. The same with vitilago. It makes you very self consious, as it did with Michael. He was always worried about what his fans thought of him and the media didn't help any either. I am just saying there are things to be looked into. As Michael said in one of his interviews. Never judge someone unless you have walked in the shoes and do not believe everything that you read in tabloids unless you talk to that person one on one. Also there was someone in that house that said that when Michael got home from rehearsel that night he asked for his sleeping medication and murray told him that he had something better for him. So its not like he asked for it. He had he own medication for his insomnia. But like I said everything at this point is mostly hear say and nobody will know anything until all the test are back.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 11:34 pm ET

In my opinion, this big stash of drugs they found could be in fact for the Long Tour – I am not saying it's right at all what the Dr. did, but they were ready to leave for the UK on a private jet, taking these meds would make sense, especially if the Dr. packed them...Like I said, it's not right..but you have a very high paid Dr. who wants to please Michael...where the h*ll was his common and ethical sense in this matter? Guess the glare from all that money blinded him. How could Cherlyn have proof like she does have for a blood panel from Feb., then turn around and Coroners say he was an addict? Let's guess here now who addicted him? I'll say no more... for now.


Rhonda   July 28th, 2009 11:36 pm ET

Please go watch the interviews that Michael did with Oprah and Geraldo. They are excellent interviews. They show a very different side to Michael. His smile, laughter and he is very shy. He was such a great gift to us and I wish that the media and some of the people would not have been so hard on him.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 11:36 pm ET

ps: True...he went to Rehab for addiction, meaning he now has a label of recovering addict-same as an alcoholic-they will always be labeled as such.


Rhonda   July 28th, 2009 11:39 pm ET

I can not remember which news I saw this on, but there is a statement from the coroner's office stating that there was three other doctors in the room when the autopsy was being done and they stated that they couldn't believe the shape that Michael was in. He was strong and healthy and there was no sign of anything wrong with the heart for them to think he went into cardiac arrest.


OCLady   July 28th, 2009 11:52 pm ET

Hi Rhonda...I'm still trying to understand the statement I heard RE the Paramedicas not realizing this was Michael Jackson for 10 Minutes? Excuse me here...BUT...did someone like THE DOCTOR not tell these men who came to help who the man in distress was-for 10 minutes? they too said he looked like an old man.

And So...why hasn't this Dr. been picked up yet? Tic Toc, Tic Toc...Waiting for more – the Last Round-Up –


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 12:07 am ET

Hi everyone,

I've been reading this blog for 3 – 4 weeks, since the death of MJ. And – the thing I want you all to know – and it's quite strange – because I've never been a real MJ fan, or smth., or I would even say I was NOT his fan.

The thing is, I've been watching CNN and LKL in particular, for a couple of months now, and every day during all the month after MJ's death now. And why would I do this – besides the fact that I do watch some foreign news (like CNN, BBC, Deutsche Welle) just for the sake of language practicing. The MJ thing started after a really very weird thing. The day before his death I looked through a web site through a link given by a member of a Ukrainian forum I'm also a member of – and the link was called smth like look what these super stars do to themselves through plastic surgery.... Don't take me wrong, but my opinion is that one's better follow the nature's course and not try and change his/her looks unless it's after some injury or smth, but not for the beautification sake – though it's all very disputable. of course – and – what did I first come to see there on that page that I linked – MJ, all his stages from very dark to very light and all in bandages or smth like that, claimed to be latest pics, and him terrible looking and in veil 'cause of his nose, as the pic said...

And what I thought then (pls don't throw stones at me, I'm not a MJ fan, never was, exept for a couple of songs that I really liked even back than – We Are The World and the Earth Song, And Liberian Girl, also, They were even all on my tapes.) But I admit I never was a real fan, No. I would rather say, I was quite on the contrary, an un-fan, if I can put it so. First, I didn't like the MJ movements re. the lower part of his torso. Well, I just didn't, neither I do now. I don't see why on earth he did that thing at the first place. Secondly, the molestation thing, That, of course, got spread all over the world, inlc. our parts, and to tell you the truth, I did believe it. Perhaps because I was not a fan. And I didn't care at all. And I was glad to believe it – maybe cause I thought a guy who does that stupid-pretending-to-be-sexy-crotch-thing could as well be a molester. And, I still don't know why he did that, do you? For a sexier effect? Hm, I guess MJ was the sexiest (I don't like the word, yes, call me a prude. but anyway) when he was his darkest. Or, perhaps, while We are the World period.

BTW, I read here on the blog a comment from a lady from Romania who claimed that MJ was banned in Romania due to the Communist rule – well, that's just some kind of BS, I can't beleive she knows what she's talking about, I guess she was just a lil girl back then and was told that story by her pasrents just to make her believe how aweful it had been back then and can you think what we had to endure)) You know, I used to have MJ's on my tapes, like everyone else who wanted to, back in the 80's, and that was in the USSR!!!! The Evil Empire, hehe, as Mr Reagan put it))) And in Romania, and other so called now post-communist states, they always used to be even more liberal, so I guess that would have had all they wanted, of the so called Western music... We in the USSR did, we could get and hear anything))
Anyway, as I said, I liked We Are the World, and I my bro in law actually got it video-recorded from the NATIOANL SOVIET TV BACK IN1987 or 1988, it was a New Year music concert))) So, give me a break with Romania and its MJ prohibition....

So – sorry I got diverted by so many by-thoughts – so when I saw those numerous MJ's pics, incl. the one of his kids – yes, and I thought – hm, he's still alive, that drugs-on molest-on pitiful man? And despite the fact that he was sleeping in some kind of an apparatus to make him live for 120 years? I guess that's was largely a thing to be imagined by you the American ppl in the USA, for that matter. Because that's what common ppl all over the world used to know and hear about MJ all their lives through. A weirdo. A wacko. Such like.

And – to get you back to my story – when next morning I woke up at 5.30 a.m. for no reason at all, and I went to bed at about 2 a.m, and I looked throgh MJ's pics round 00.00. and that was about the time (as I found out later) that he was considered dead... (I'm out of work at teh moment and don't have to go up that early) and what I thought when looked at his pics on the web – well, he's not dead yet, hm...... yes, that's what I thought.... and it's been yeras since I saw a pic of MJ and ever had a thought about him.... and here I see numeroud pics of him and think why is he still alive with all stuff he did to himself?and then I wake up with the only thought to turn on TV NOW – and I do, and here's me looking through the channels, and here I see CNN and BBC and Deutche Welle and French TV5 and our TV, with all THAT news... well, what can I say...

And after reading this blog kudos to CNN, Larry (though I don't really like your manner, frankly), and particularly girls here – Jacquelyn, Linda, Michelle from Canada and others – I really came to understand what a person MJ really was.... And I'm really sorry if those girls really decided to leave this blog... Been reading you guys for weeks, and I really stopped and thought for the first time on the lyrics of The Man In The Morror – a great song.... applies to any of us, really.... Why don't we... No matter where we we live... we should before too late....It's a choice we're making...


Rhonda   July 29th, 2009 12:07 am ET

When who ever it was that made the 911 call, didn't identify himself or tell the 911 operator that he was calling for help with Michael Jackson. All he said was that there was a gentleman in trouble who is not breathing and is not responding to cpr and that there was a doctor there on scene and he told the 911 operator that cpr was being preformed on the bed and the 911 operator told him to move the person to the floor. They didn't tell the paramedics that it was Michael that they were working on.


Toni   July 29th, 2009 12:26 am ET

Lena, kiev, ukraine
Don't worry, we come back. We made a different site to be able to talk about things we really don't want CNN to hear. We don't stay gone for long.


marciaconder   July 29th, 2009 12:32 am ET

why is conrad murray the scapegoat for all doctor involved?


Toni   July 29th, 2009 12:33 am ET

Lena, Kiev , Ukraine
Stay with us and we will teach you who the real Michael Jackson was, and why he meant so much to so many people all over the world. The first thing you need to do, is stop reading the tabloids. He had a reason for everything he did, it's just alot of people didn't take the time or care to find out.


Daisy   July 29th, 2009 12:35 am ET

Michael might have looked different when the paramedics came because he may look different when at homet han when he went out in public. He wore make-up in public.


Rhonda   July 29th, 2009 12:39 am ET

Michael always said stop reading and buying the tabloids that they do nothing but lie. He was so right. Michael really had a skin disease called Vitilago. He really did have lupus. He did in fact have 3rd degree burns to the head. He did in fact break his nose twice. He did in fact break his back. He did in fact have insomnia and he had a bone disorder. He also was very depressed. He DID NOT however molest any children. He DID NOT buy the elephant man bones. He DID NOT bleach his skin.


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 12:39 am ET

And also, I don't think that MJ's problems, if any, resulted from his family upbringing. Here I totally agree with Jacquelyn. Though I'm not an African-americn, hah, as you can guess – I'm Ukrainian. That's in eastern Europe. And I'm half-Russian, can you imagine)))

Well. my point is, that discipline is good thing for kids at times. Especially if you want them (and if they also want) to achieve smth... If they don't – well. I don't know... I think a talented person does want to achieve smth... and the parents' role is to support and encourage the kids.. And I giess for every kid and parent there are different ways of supporting and encouraging.. Abuse exluded. of course. But I don't think Joe Jackson abused Michael... Perhaps Michael was too sensitive and at a difficult time in his life he came to accuse his dad of his failures in some aspects of life? Well, I don't know for sure how it;s said in English – the thing in the Bible about our parents and respecting them... and I think that no matter what...they brought us into this world, just for that we should be thankful... IMO


Toni   July 29th, 2009 1:00 am ET

Michael stated alot of times that he forgave his dad and felt bad for telling Oprah what he did. The media is taking what Michael said years ago. Thats the point. they don't take the time to listen to what Michael has said in his own words in recent years. I truely believe Joe Jackson loved his son, and Michael has said repeatedly that he loved his dad. I don't know, for the life of me, why the media have to argue with this subject all the time. And NG is the worst one for it

Rhonda
But yet they call him a street junkie for needing something for pain, anxiety, depression, and sleep deprivation. God what is wrong with people. It's like if someone in a high profile world has any problem in this country, it's a joke so people can have a laugh or two, then that person is mocked and trashed until they are hardly able to function anymore. Then we have to take another few months to decide whether or not that person is worthy of being helped. I guess Britney was the lucky one.


Toni   July 29th, 2009 1:12 am ET

Lena, kiev, ukraine

They wont have the same names entirely like they have on this blog. So maybe add something to your name that connects you with this one so they will know who you are and that you came from this blog.
I havent rejoined yet. It was only made yesterday. I went on, but didnt recognize the {new} names, so I left thinking I had the wrong blog, but I actually did. So Ive still got to rejoin soon. Actually, after you join, write a comment and tell them Toni sent you and they will know where you came from. Tell them I will rejoin tomorrow. I dont have time tonight. It takes a little while to join, and i'm too tired tonight. Good luck.


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 1:13 am ET

Another thing

I'm a caucasian, as you Americans would put it, though for us that would mean someone residing in the Caucasian mountains (the Caucasus) , and that often would mean Muslim and not so white as you imply by this word)) But anyway. For me – for me – it's no problem whatever shade of skin a person has, it just depends on his/hers personal qualities as an average human being...

Mreover, in terms of religion – I am an orthodox Christian, I would say that religion is the strictest in the Christioan wing, well, so what? Who says I can't go and pray in a Catholic cathedral, or a mosque, or a sinagogue?

And though I've been to a Catholic cathedral and thorouly enjoyed the spledour and the music, and I've been to an Anglican church in the UK as well... I never dared entering eitherr a mosque or a sinagogue, though I\m sure if I could I would)) The God is one, and to him neither your skin colour or religion does matter.....


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 1:14 am ET

Thanks a lot, Toni 🙂


Rhonda   July 29th, 2009 1:15 am ET

Toni,
Yes Michael said over and over that he loved his dad, but he didn't know him as well as he would like. I truly believe Michael when he said that his dad was abusing him. I do blame Joe for some of Michael's issues. I hate it when I still see people calling him a junkie, drug user and wacko jacko. He was far from being wacko, the man was a music genius and he had dance moves that were unbelievable. To me personally, Michael was a gorgeous man and he would have been a great husband and he was a great father. He is truly missed by more than he isn't by others.


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 1:19 am ET

Thanks, Toni, but

Hm, this kind of blog/comminity seems a bit different, do I have to register there to log in? I guess yes, but funny I can't see where))


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 1:32 am ET

It's ok.now, Toni, thanks again


Julie   July 29th, 2009 1:38 am ET

Michael was mostly a loving father, and humanitarian. He tried to heal the world through is music. He was childlike inside, and always tried to maintain the innocence of a child, so that he could stay as pure as he could. You never hear him curse, or make fun or bad mouth anyone. Although, I did watch one video where he called his cameraman a dip whit. lol Even then, he could have said dip , or dim whit.

Now, I do understand why the other half of the world might say that he was immature, and a little odd, but I think his ideal, that if more people in the world maintained the innocence of a child, we WOULD all be in a better place.

People out there are too scared to feel the love and compassion for strangers, that Michael tried to show. The charity work he did was selfless. He never did it for acclaim.

When it comes to loving, even when at the hands of the "devil" or media and prejudices, he fought back the tears, took the slaps in the face, and continued his mission to heal the world. One child at a time. That is more of a man, then any ego maniac calling him a fag or perv.


Julie   July 29th, 2009 1:40 am ET

I wish the world had more like him, and I am going to miss hi so much. I think we all are. Fan or not!


Rhonda   July 29th, 2009 1:43 am ET

Michael may be gone in spirit, but as fans, we can keep his music and his beliefs alive forever. My youngest is only 14 and she kinda knew who he was cause I loved him and his music. But now she is really into watching his videos that we have and watching him dance and she picks up quickly.


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 1:53 am ET

Julie, you did put it nicely!


Lena, Kiev, Ukraine   July 29th, 2009 2:00 am ET

Can any people of non-Christian faith share their feelings of being (if ever) in a different faith's temple? What they felt, and also what do they think of people of a different religion? Sorry I'm not familiar with the kinds of movements you have in the US, I mean still being Christian..

My opinion is that after all we all should be .... united as one


Toni   July 29th, 2009 2:05 am ET

Julie
Dip,wit! LOL thats funny. I can just picture him saying that.

Rhonda
I agree 100%,
Michael, unfortunately, is gone,but that beautiful voice and the messages he sent arent going anywhere.


Dirty Diana   July 29th, 2009 2:16 am ET

Great interview with Steve Harvey on youtube (2003). I love his giggle.


Lisa   July 29th, 2009 3:29 am ET

Lena, Kiev, Ukraine:

Welcome to the dicsussions!

I ´think that the relation between Michaels dad and Michael has affected him mostly. The level of violence you can always dicsuss and it is often a huge disagreement between grown up children and their parents about this. The parents dont see it as hitting and for the children, being small when it happend it was a very traumatic experience. But I dont think that was the biggest problem between the dad and michael. The biggest problem was their totally different personalities. Michael has proven to be VERY sensitive and very soft and human. The dad is a man of action. He has a goal, and he walk over corpses if necessary. The dad is very loud and expressive. Michael is soft spoken and withdrawn. Michael cares about details and the small individuals. The dad looks more to the whole picture and solve problems the quickest way, even if that means hurting a few souls. I just thin they clashed in all ways and just didnt understand each other.

I also belive that Michael childhood wasnt what affected him mostly. I think his adolecents / teenages has affected him mostly. After all, when he was a child, he always had a lot of kids around him. He had 8 siblings which is a treasure. Compare with for instance Brooke Shields, Judy Garland, or other child stars that mostlytraveld alone and spend most of hteir youth with adults. So, I think that what he missed in his development was being a teenager. Hang out with friends, dating, all the joy and disapointment that that part of your life includes, is vital for growing up and develop as a stable and happy individual. Unless you compensate that later on with teraphy or other ways, you will lack important step in your development.

We must remember though, that without all the elements that created Michael Jackson, he would just have been anybody. Maybe with huge talents but there are many who has. He might have been much happier, had a better life but we wouldnt know him. The unique combination that he was could only exist with all its components. So, we got a great gift, and he paied with his happiness. I will be forever thankful for that, Michael!


Jen   July 29th, 2009 6:44 am ET

Daisy...I read somewhere that Dr Klein used Diprivan in his office when he did surgical procedures and wasn't Murray and Klein familiar with each other. Klein has been mum lately. I bet he is the biggest dealer here. I bet he provided MJ with a supply of Diprivan.


Ce Ce   July 29th, 2009 7:03 am ET

Hi there Lena in Kiev, Ukraine!! Your english is excellent!
I was NO Fan . Cause it allways looked like Michael and the people around him had issues of a different kind... As soon as I heard the newson the radio upon waking up the 25 th of June I started to look for facts. I had turned away and ignored everything about M. J. because it is very hard to make a neutral a just judgement from a distance with only being fed the crap from all the sensational Journalism. I looked at youtube and came across the twofaced and distorted Interview from that London based Journalist Bashiri. Then I found out, that Michael and his crew had their own cameras running during the entire time with the original uncut comments and questions from Bashiri. Michael put this version out in the open on the Today show – I think – to set things straight about that canniving way how Bashiri cut together M.J.´s statements to continue the rumors and speculation from the past. Michael´s version can be found under the title Living With Michael – Take 2 . I suggest you take some time and do some research on You tube to listen to Michael – uncut and untouched. What you see and hear there from Michael, Debbie and some of his staff will open your eyes, brake your heart and make you want to say you are sorry for believing all the crap from the tabloids. Lokking to hear from you....


OCLady   July 29th, 2009 10:48 am ET

Good Morning, Everyone...

Lisa...I have noticed that as well about the fire or life going out in Michael's eyes. The only real time he had life in there, during any interview is when he was either talking with Oprah or Geraldo – As for that 'other Interviewer'-After the short interview he gave after Michael passed, Well...too little too late. The medal – I blame it in part of the media, the other part, the poeple who had a vendetta or some kind of score to settle.

I guess now reports are saying that this so called Dcotor was in Michaels' employ ONLY since this past May. not even a month. I checked this 'Dr's credentials, he only has 40 hrs of patient care and 40 hrs. of business accumilated with the State of CA., not much at all, considering he's been 'licensed' as a Cardiologist for 10 years in CA.


Elisheva, Jerusalem/Israel   July 29th, 2009 11:33 am ET

@ Lisa

Thanks for the links, I will look at them later tonight!


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