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February 23, 2010

China Reacts to LKL Dalai Lama Interview

Posted: 08:03 PM ET

The Chinese Embassy in the U.S. issued the following statement today, reacting to our interview last night with the Dalai Lama and his visit to the United States.

Statement of Chinese Embassy in the U.S.on Dalai's visit in the United States

What Dalai Lama has said and done in the past decades have fully shown that he is not a pure religious figure, but a political figure in exile who's long engaged in activities to split China and undermine ethnic unity in China under the cover of religion. While claiming that his visits to foreign countries are aimed at spreading religious teachings, he has never stopped defaming the Chinese Government, selling “Tibet independence” proposals and undermining relations between China and other countries. This is well reflected in his remarks during his current visit, including those he made on CNN's Larry King Live.

In addition, the talks between Dalai’s private representatives and the Chinese Government at the end of January have demonstrated once again that the Dalai group is still clinging to their separatist propositions, including the so-called “greater Tibet region” and “meaningful autonomy”, whose ultimate goal is to separate a quarter of Chinese territory from China. This is something that no sovereign country can allow to occur.

As Dalai Lama claimed on Larry King Live, he regards a foreign country other than China or its Tibetan Autonomous Region as his "home", and Tibet is "not much concern" to him. Such a political figure is in no way qualified to represent the Tibetan people as self-claimed by him.

Tibet has never been a country in history, but an inalienable part of China from ancient times. Dalai Lama's repeated calling Tibet a "country" explains nothing but his true mind of splitting Tibet from China. We urge the U.S. side earnestly abide by the U.S. Government's committment [sic] of recognizing Tibet as part of China and not supporting "Tibet independence", take measures to undo the damages caused by Dalai's visit, stop providing convenience or platform for Dalai and pro-Tibet independence forces, take concret [sic] actions to maintain the healthy and stable development of China-U.S. relations. We sincerely hope American people see through Dalai's true nature as a separatist and his ulterior motive of sabotaging China-U.S. relations, understand and support China's just positions on Tibet-related issues.

Filed under: China • Dalai Lama • Larry King Live


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A. Smith, Oregon   February 23rd, 2010 9:04 pm ET

Ancient history appears to entirely show that Tibet was not part of China. China never had any influence nor part of forming the Tibetan Language. China never had any influence nor part of forming the Tibetan Buddhist faith and religion. The extreme altitudes do not bode well on the bodys of the Chinese people that are forced to relocate in Tibet in Chinas overt effort to eradicate the Tibetan Language, Religion, Culture and PEOPLE.

The Dalai Lama is the spiritual ruler and leader of the Tibetan Buddhist religion and faith. A clear majority of Tibetans see the Dalai Lama as a very important figure, much more identifiable than a faceless Chinese leader and his secret service lackeys.

Is China adopting Tibet's Religion, Faith, Language? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Does China routinely teach the Tibetan Language in its mainland Chinese schools? NO it is forcing even the Tibetan people to learn Chinese and speak only Chinese.

Is China adopting Tibet's Religion and Faith of Tibetan Buddhism? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Thousands of Buddhist temples thru-out Tibet were totally destroyed, their monks and nuns murdered.


Cindy   February 23rd, 2010 9:13 pm ET

As a Chinese,I do not support Dalai’s viewpoint and do not understand why President Obama receive Dalai.


Caesar   February 23rd, 2010 9:15 pm ET

@A. Smith, Oregon Stop posting your only argument everywhere. Did you just copy pasted what's on the other blog? Come out with something new and more persuasive please!


Idzan Ismail, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia   February 23rd, 2010 9:30 pm ET

Hello world
China has spoken.
There are two sides to every story.
We now gain perspective on Tibet- China relations and the undermining by the Dalai Lama.
The gist of the China message is others do not meddle.
It's their country and their destiny.
It's their business and theirs alone.


Joe G. (Illinois)   February 23rd, 2010 9:41 pm ET

Such uproar the Dalai Lama is causing. So..! This great man of peace and tranquility cannot have peace or rest unless he has what he wants..! Worldwide veneration, admiration, holy recognition, etc, etc, etc, etc, and a piece of China to call his own little autonomous planet.. “On this planet.” Dalai Lama don’t ask for much.. Does he?!


Hesser   February 23rd, 2010 9:45 pm ET

Yesterday the poll question was Should Tibet be an independent country? Yesterday morning Yes 88% and No 12% but at the end of the day result was like this. Yes 8% 6487No 92% 71691Total Votes: 78178. Being myself American, i guaranteed that most Americans people support and believe that Tibet should be independent but this poll news was vastly spread within the chinese people in US and elsewhere and the vote changed drastically. I am afraid that Chinese hackers in China backing by their government can do anything for their benefits.
Americans and most people in free country know how China and Chinese government is. So, there is not much to debate because Chinese think they are always right even when they are in fault. China is not America. Chinese government behaving of their mischievous acts towards Tibet and Tibetans.


Fair   February 23rd, 2010 10:10 pm ET

Tibet is an inalienable part of China .Anyone who can not shake the!


onenormalperson   February 23rd, 2010 10:15 pm ET

As a chinese, I support Dalai. Communist China Government is not a legal government, it is not selected by people.


namdol   February 23rd, 2010 10:22 pm ET

The Dalai Lama wants peace not for himself but for the six million Tibetans who regard him as their leader. He has already reached a destination where ordinary human like me or you have not in this life. He wants peace between Tibetans and Chinese persuading the People's Republic of China's (PRC) government to give genuine autonomy to Tibetans. No human being will want to give up freedom, whether of self or country but Tibetans are willing to do that by agreeing to the "Middle Path Approach" of The Dalai Lama. The Middle Path calls for autonomy to the Tibetans within the framework of PRC's constitution. This will be a win-win situation for both sides.
Do not doubt this man of peace who has held the Tibetans in unison so far with his teachings of peace, compassion, patience, and nonviolence. It is hard to find violent struggle of Tibetans in the news. Carrying the attitude of their business and their destiny does not work in this age/century of globalization where all must come together and work to make our planet a better place to live in. It would be inhuman to ignore the tragedy going on in your neighborhood because it may engulf you as well. We are all dependent on each other and this is interdependency. Those who are interested in Tibet, go to Tibet and also go and meet Exiled Tibetans in India, Nepal, Canada, and even US, and see how they live and what their views are. Ignorance could lead to misconceptions and one is not to be blamed but if not eradicated, it then may lead to conflicts.


Kevin Chen   February 23rd, 2010 10:24 pm ET

I don't know why you Americans care so much about the OUR OWN thing. It's really none of your business. Would you guys be really happy if a lot of Chinese people keep saying one of the Florida is not part of America? Sorry that I cannot understand your logic here. Politics is never something you can easily put your trust in.


POPO   February 23rd, 2010 10:26 pm ET

As a Chinese, I have to say - THIS IS OUR OWN BUSINESS. Why should other countries including US interfere our own business? Why should people from other countries complain about it? Before saying something about Tibet, have you ever been to Tibet? Or should I ask have you ever been to China? How long have you been living in China? Do you know exactly what China is like?
Before saying things about Tibet, GO TO CHINA, GO TO TIBET. Or else, you don't have the right!!!!


Hans   February 23rd, 2010 10:49 pm ET

Hello, I'm a Chinese youth and I have some view that I'd like to share.
I can always see people saying CHINESE GOVERNMENT ... but NOT CHINESE PEOPLE .. .I mean that China and Chinese government are made up of Chinese people, when you say Chinese government is doing something and how it thinks is saying that what most Chinese people are doing and thinking.
PLEASE NEVER FORGET THAT!
I love China including Tibet, I love Chinese people including Tibetans who are very hospitable to everyone. Each of my friend who has been to Tibet tells me that Tibet is a beautiful place and the people there are friendly.
I'm sure that you don't know that when a Chinese college std graduates from college he can choose to teach in Tibet for 2 years unless he is one of the best stds. And Tibetan youth can go to the universities around China in a very low score! What's more, when they are in school, they can receive some good policies that I DO NEVER HAVE!
China is developing but not developed at all! China is China, not America or any other. There're so many people in China , they're all CHINESE though they have some in common and some not.
And finally I'd like to suggest you that if you want to know the truth, the best way to it is to see it yourself. So how Tibetans people live , you'd best go to Tibet and see it yourself. And then you'll know the truth no matter which is right . Chiness people are always friendly and hospitable to the friends all around the world, and the gate is always open to the world! WELCOME TO CHINA at any time you want!


Diane Wilson   February 23rd, 2010 10:56 pm ET

I beg C.N.N. to provide subtitles for people like the Dalai Lama and Henry Lee for that matter who is another frequent guest on Larry King. My heart sinks when they appear, as although I am interested in what they have to say, their accents are so strong that I can make out one word in five : extremely frustrating for viewers around the world!


Zhong Lin   February 23rd, 2010 10:57 pm ET

In United States it is illegal for a foreign country to fund a local politician. People have gone to jail for that.

So why do United States funds so many anti-China forces such as the Dalai Lama, the Uighur Rebiya. Fa Lun Gong groups etc ?

Do you think it is right ?


Ed   February 23rd, 2010 11:19 pm ET

I have no idea why CNN set up a "poll" on whether Tibet, as currently a province of China, should be independent.

ISN'T IT SIMILAR to setting up a "poll" on whether Texas, as currently a state of U.S., should be independent?

If we don't want something as ridiculous as this, why should we do it to another country?


king   February 23rd, 2010 11:20 pm ET

speak the facts,before express your views , you must study seriously the history of China ,otherwise,you have not permissions to speak.


danny   February 23rd, 2010 11:21 pm ET

it's no business of America


John H   February 23rd, 2010 11:21 pm ET

It seems to me that the issue here has been turned around bassackward. Since when do we allow the government of another nation dictate who we may welcome in this country and who we may support. The issue is do we have a right to welcome the Dali Lama or any other individual to our country and the White House or must we cave in to the demands of another country in these issues. Please cite me one instance where the People's Repbulic of China has caved in to any demand made upon them made upon them by their own people much less by an outside power? (Tiniamen Square) If we offer support to Taiwan or to a visit from the Dali Lama, it is no one's business than our own. In addition to that, A. Smith of Oregon's point that Tibet has not historically always been a part of China is a valid point. Shortly after World War II, there was a civil war in which the Communist Faction won. The losing faction established itself on the off shore island of Taiwan and in that sense, they have every right to their existence as does the Communits Government of China. Do we now owe so much money to the Chinese Government that we must bow down to their every demand? I think not!


Gerald Jolly   February 23rd, 2010 11:28 pm ET

The true reality of things is.

With the mountain of domestic problems we have in the U.S. we do not need to create another diplomatic nightmare.

President Obama meeting with the Dalai Lama is a huge mistake in diplomatic decorum.

I do not say that the U.S. should not have accomedated the Dalai Lama, but could have had someone from our Secretary of State Department meeting with him as a jesture of courtesy.

We have an economy that is on the verge of crashing, we have millions of Americans loosing their homes and jobs, we have the worse health care system of any country in the free world, we have two parties that would rather attack each other than to deal with the problems of the people that elected them in order to look after the needs of the people, we have political corruption to the point that no one could have ever imagined, we have the greedy parisites on Wall Street and at our banks paying themselves scurelous bonuses after the taxpayers of our country bailed them out, we have auto workers that will never see the inside of an automobile assembly line, and loosing their homes, and health care for their families, we have seniors in our country having to cash in the K4's because of the measly pentioned afforded them through our retirement funds, we have the largest amount of child poverty in the history of our country even worse than during the great depression, we have school closures uprecedent in our entire history, we have our prisons bursting at the seams. AND WE HAVE THOUSANDS OF SIMILAR PROBLEMS, to many to mention.

And what is our government focused on???

Insuring that we anger China to a dgree that could lead to a cold war situation because we want to focus our attention on a Foriegn Religious leader, that is only doing what he does to infuriate the Chinese government, and our foriegn department is to STUPID to see that they are being used to that purpose.

GOD BLESS AMERICA, and GOD BLESS the CHINESE GOVERNMENT THAT WE OWE MORE THAN A TRILLION DOLLARS TOO, at an interest rate that is costing the Amercan taxpayer $4.7 million dollars a day in interest alone.

And what does our State Department do???

Look at each othetr and say "DUH"

Can anyone explain to me, what your bank manager would say when you wanted to borrow money from him. just after you have insulted him, his wife, and his children.

"I WONDER"


DQ   February 23rd, 2010 11:29 pm ET

onenormalperson February 23rd, 2010 10:15 pm ET

shame with you, can you call yourself a chinese?
Maybe 70 years ago you will say:"I support the Japanese. Neither KMT nor CCP is elected by people."
What a shame!


namdol   February 23rd, 2010 11:46 pm ET

I am a Tibetan and my whole family is in Tibet. AND it is totally my business when it comes to me and my family and not Chinese's. As a Tibetan I have full right to present the truth. Tibet has never been an inalienable part of China. Where did you get that? Look at the true history. You Chinese did not know about the world views of Tibet before coming out of China as you cannot do this in China (govt censorship). You are just spreading the propoganda fed by the Chinese Govt. We say Chinese government and not Chinese people because the Chinese govt is not elected by the Chinese people. If your govt is you then why did you punish your Charter 08 writers and signatories?
China is stubborn and will not listen because it is a colonizer. If Tibetans in Tibet are happy then why they went underground and arranged 235 protests in 2008 not only in China recognized Tibet but wherever the Tibetans live, that is the three provinces of independent Tibet. Why thousands of Tibetans have risked their lives walking across the harsh conditions of Himalayas and escape to India and which is still happening TODAY. Please open your eyes and look at the reality, The Tibetans are agreeing to live under China as a true autonomous region with freedom of rights and expression and not asking for a separate country. Is not that in the benefit for both Tibet and China? Then why the Chinese government not listening. This is the middle way approach where both sides win. There is no better way than this. Only other way is either indpendent Tibet or the continued turbulence inside Tibet, which would never die.


Solang Tadasana   February 23rd, 2010 11:55 pm ET

When I visited Dharamsala in 2005, I asked a young waiter who was serving my spouse and I our food how he felt about Tibet. This 18-year old said he and many of his generation are angry about the loss of a Tibetan homeland he's never seen and may never be able to visit due to Chinese imperialism. So for leaders of such a "powerful" country like China to be fearful and angry about one man who is perhaps in his final years, reveals that these leaders have something to hide or obscure. These unelected leaders and descendants of Mao's political lineage sometimes behave more like anxious children throwing media temper tantrums when things don't go their way. Relatedly- China's leaders also order the blockage of different points of views by fire-walling and censoring information access and exchange on the internet. What are they so afraid of?


Jack   February 23rd, 2010 11:55 pm ET

Ancient history appears to entirely show that Texas was not part of the U.S. The U.S. never had any influence nor part of forming the Texan Spanish Language. The U.S. never had any influence nor part of forming the Texan Roman Catholic faith and religion. The extreme altitudes do not bode well on the bodys of the American people that are forced to relocate in Texas in the U.S. overt effort to eradicate the Spanish Language, Religion, Culture and PEOPLE in Texas.

The Texas Nationalist Movement is the spiritual ruler and leader of the Roman Catholicism religion and faith. A clear majority of Texans see the The Texas Nationalist Movement as a very important figure, much more identifiable than a faceless U.S president and his secret service lackeys.

Is the U.S adopting Texas' Religion, Faith, Language? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Does the U.S. routinely teach the Spanish Language in its mainland English schools? NO it is forcing even the Texan people to learn English and speak only English.

Is the U.S. adopting Texas' Religion and Faith of The Texas Nationalist Movement? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Thousands of Indians and Mexican Villages thru-out Texas were totally destroyed, their men and women murdered.


Wendy X   February 24th, 2010 12:02 am ET

Yes we have right to dominant our things.No matter what the White House has done, that's all our matters.We still have our pride to stand on our power ,tech and a lot of others.

Although one-side policy is rejected by some parts, we still insist on the truth and faith.

By the way, the latest news is what we own most is Japan,not China.


kidd   February 24th, 2010 12:06 am ET

Those people who said tibet was not part of china were not the turly chinese ,we have different situation with the other conutries ,if you know the historty of china ,yon can certaninly find out tibet belong to china since yuan dynasty,how can you say tibet was not part of china?on the other hand ,so many foriners suppot the independence of tibet because of your own countries dishonest and false cover ,if you have a chance ,i hope you can come to china ,to know a real china!!!


Gerald Jolly   February 24th, 2010 12:11 am ET

Can anyone please explain to me why we Americans have this passion for "SELF DESTRUCTION"

2000 we elect a man as our President who is a known coward that went A.W.O.L. for 9 months in 72/73 rather than answer the call to duty.

We then went a step further into stupidity when we allowed this same scoundrel to steal an election four years later, by backroom deals with the Supreme court.

We allowed this same man to bring us to war based on nothing more than orchestrated lies about W.M.D.'s

We went even a step further when we allowed this "POOR EXCUSE" for a man man allow Wall Street and the Banks to be deregulated, thereby causing the complete destruction of our economy, loss of homes and jobs and the liteny goes on.

We now have a government that is willing to infuriate another super power by insulting that super power, by befriending their enemy.

We promised China to not get involved in the affairs of their country, and yet we sell $3.3 billion dollars of advanced weaponry to a part of the country that wishes to cecede from the mainland government.

We have gone even a step further by infuriating the only country that is willing to lend us a huge amount of money so that we can continue to fight unjust wars even while the rest of the world are very displeased with our actions and methods.

There was a time not so long ago after WW2 when American enjoyed the love and popularity of every free country in the world.

And even though our government wont agree with it, we are now the most hated country in the entire world.

On a scale of one to ten on how we are looked at favorably we are now rated at "MINUS TEN"

GEEEEEZZZZZZ!

Will it ever end??????????????


biaojun3   February 24th, 2010 12:11 am ET

Tibetan is a small part of China!
This infact can not changed by anybody just like that US no longer belongs to Indians.


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 12:12 am ET

And the Chinese Govt. itself chose to issue a 'talking point' to Larry King!

Wow, that certainly is a surprise. The 'official' line on what to think, speak, scratch and sniff in regards to last nights interview with the Dalai Lama.

When a lie is repeatedly offered as the 'official' State version on what occurred, when if ever is that accepted as 'truth'?

Shortly after Tiananmen Square occurred in 1989, State spinner's began giving the 'official' lie on Tiananmen Square, how and why that massive protest occurred. Is the 'official' State version of Tiananmen Square now seen as the 'truth' by the Chinese people after 21 YEARS? NO!


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 12:18 am ET

If Tibet were ever part of China in the previous thousand years, Tibet would speak and write Chinese. The Tibetan language spoken and written is ENTIRELY different from Chinese. Their culture, faith and religion is entirely different.

Tibet was land grabbed by the Chinese Govt. and the Tibetan people do not want the Chinese people nor the Chinese govt. interfering with them, their country and their culture.


kimi   February 24th, 2010 12:18 am ET

Obviously, a group of people who have ulterior motives, they want use some cattish ways to separate China, to get some benefit. They use money to drive people make some trouble、 cheating online( I am Tibetan, I Suffer from Chinese persecution).


Angela   February 24th, 2010 12:20 am ET

A. Smith, Oregon said, "Ancient history appears to entirely show that Tibet was not part of China. China never had any influence nor part of forming the Tibetan Language."
Stop lying before you do some study about China history. Tibetan has been a province of China more than 600 years, much longer than America History. Chinese do speak thousands of languages (Because Chinese are a mix of many ethnic cultures.), Tibetan is one kind of them. Similarly, American speak English, French, Chinese, Korean, Spanish... because Americans came from everywhere on this planet.

"The Dalai Lama is the spiritual ruler and leader of the Tibetan Buddhist religion and faith. A clear majority of Tibetans see the Dalai Lama as a very important figure, much more identifiable than a faceless Chinese leader and his secret service lackeys." You were half right here. A clear majority of Tibetans do see the Dalai Lama as a very important figure and they have the freedom to do so. I have been Tibet once, people hang Dalai's pictures at their homes and temples. Did it tell you that Chinese government and the rest of Chinese show their respect to Tibetans?

"Is China adopting Tibet's Religion, Faith, Language? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Does China routinely teach the Tibetan Language in its mainland Chinese schools? NO it is forcing even the Tibetan people to learn Chinese and speak only Chinese."
A big lie here again. In China, in every big ethnic area, Chinese/Mandarin schools are just an option to them, they do have their own language schools. Such as Inner Mongolia, A lot of Mongolian ethnic people (I use this term to distinguish them from the people live in the country of Mongolia) only speak Mongolian for their whole life. No matter what ethnic group we belong, we are Chinese, so we have our official language, which is the Mandarin. We want to learn it because we need communicate with other ethnic people and we all are Chinese.

"Is China adopting Tibet's Religion and Faith of Tibetan Buddhism? NO it is doing everything it can to eradicate and destroy it. Thousands of Buddhist temples thru-out Tibet were totally destroyed, their monks and nuns murdered."

Please stop lying and lying. Tibetan Buddhism is a branch of the Buddhism. Buddhism is the most popular religion in China. You maybe don't know, it was adopted from India. Tibetan Buddhism or other Buddhism were originated from India and developed to different forms. Would you ask Christian and Catholic to adopt each other's believe?
And thousands of Buddhist temples were destroyed at everywhere of China at 1960's, especially in cities. I think most of people knew that if he/she heard of Culture Revolution of China. It was a tragedy to every Chinese of that time. However, we learned our lessons through our own mistakes and we all Chinese look forward to peaceful life and freedom of governing our own country without worrying about what American would say. Just like we don't tell American to do this and do that. Would you please don't judge others either?


Gerald Jolly   February 24th, 2010 12:20 am ET

@ A. Smith Oregon.

Are you trying to equate the death of one chinese student, to the seven students that were killed at Kent State in the 70's

You know the seven students that were protesting the war in Vietnam and the draft????

That our government sais, did not happen and that those seven students were radicals protesting against the government of the United States, IS THAT THE ONES YOU ARE REFERRING TOO.???

A. Smith, I have a great respect for your loyalty to our country and you have proven to be a very intelligent individual in my mind.

But if you will excuse my opinion.

"I FEEL THAT IT IS YOU THAT HAS BEEN BRAINWASHED BY FALSE PROPOGANDA" from the corrupt politicians of our country.


DQ   February 24th, 2010 12:23 am ET

The cultural conflict cannot be merged.
Westerners may tell words like "freedom", "liberty", "human right" and so on, but in the Han culture circle, how dare one or several persons disobey most of the others' will?
So us could never persuade the chinese PEOPLE and vice versa.
But I hope one day the Han culture could rule the world.


T.   February 24th, 2010 12:24 am ET

Chinese scare me, all this mass of people supporting occupation and destruction of the whole nation of Tibet, poisoning of environment, destroying culture, all this mass of seemingly mindless people who continue thinking Tibet is Chinese. On what grounds, people???
President Obama is very smart and meeting Dalai Lama was the right thing to do, because China should not control US or any other country, it is so ridiculous to see on a world stage Chinese squeecks every time Dalai Lama going somewhere. Maybe the whole world should put brakes on China's oppression (there must be a way).


DQ   February 24th, 2010 12:31 am ET

@ A. Smith Oregon.

China is a giant country. Most parts of it have their own dialect. But remember, the only OFFICIAL language is HAN.
Just like me, I can speak mandarin in LA, how dare you say I CAN establish a new country in California?


DQ   February 24th, 2010 12:35 am ET

@T.

Without the basic knowledge of the chinese history, you will never understand our IRON WILL and our EAGER to protect our homeland.


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 12:36 am ET

The Chinese Govt. and their secret police, round up people with pictures of the Dalai Lama, force them into re-education camps and severely punish them if they do no denounce the Dalai Lama.

Is that the kind and compassionate Chinese Govt. to which you work for?


Hu   February 24th, 2010 12:39 am ET

to be simple, china as a fasting growing power, in some Westerner's mind, is threatening them. SO some negative comments are always unavoidable, remember it that China is not what media says about it, to understand a country on paper is very ridiculous.


mok   February 24th, 2010 12:44 am ET

we,chinese people,are not the slaves of our government.we may disagree with our gov, but as for the territory issue, the government's attitude is based on the majority of chinese people's view,that is tibet is part of china.

you just see tibet as a wonderland,you want china government to preserve every aspect of tibetan culture.but you ignore that tibet needs development.in china,so many people are still too poor to feed themselves.

as for tibetan,they need to use newly invented machine and technology,
they need to learn sth about science,
they need to learn other language so they can do trade with other nations or develop their tourism.
...

so if they still live as if they were in a museum just for your foreigners to appreciate their original life,they won't have the right to develop, or at least feed themselves.

sorry for making so many grammar mistakes


Laurie   February 24th, 2010 12:46 am ET

@Jack:

It seems that in changing A. Smith's post, you are trying to indicate that the U.S. would feel the same way as China does if it were happening in our country. However, I believe your post shows more clearly how unreasonable China is being.

To go with your analogy, you are correct that Texas was not always part of the U.S. We don't deny this. We also don't deny that we took Texas by force in the past from Mexico, who in turn took it from various Native American groups. However, I think you will find that in most cases, we are not proud of that part of our history and do not colonize any longer. Furthermore, even though this happened many decades ago, we are still trying to make amends (though we are admittedly doing a poor job) by providing sovereignty to Native Americans within the U.S.– similar to the autonomy Tibet is seeking, I believe.

In addition, regarding the language and culture, you obviously have not been to Texas. The U.S., and Texas in particular, embrace the Spanish language and culture. You will find many place names to be Spanish, many buildings to be in the Spanish style, and many Spanish speakers living in Texas and elsewhere. You will also find many Mexican food restaurants, Mexican celebrations, and more. And yes, the U.S. *is* routinely teaching Spanish in many of its public and private schools.

This is not to say that U.S. / Mexican relations and U.S. / Native American relations are without problems. There are many who feel that we should be more or less friendly with our neighbors and U.S. cultural groups than we currently are. But we welcome open discussion about it and try to find that "middle ground" to the best of our ability.

So thank you for posting this comparison. It really helps to clarify what is problematic about China's dealings with Tibet and the Dalai Llama.


Idzan Ismail, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia   February 24th, 2010 12:50 am ET

@Gerald Jolly
You are a breath of fresh air.


Randael   February 24th, 2010 12:56 am ET

MAY TIBET ONE DAY BE FREE .
MAY CHINA ONE DAY BE FREE FROM COMMUNISM.
PEACE 🙂


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 1:00 am ET

Yes Gerald Jolly, The US Calvary, US Govt. and some angry American settlers mowed down the Native people in North America, from 3 million all the way down to a mere 300,000. And they forbid many expressions of their native culture to be taught in public schools, including their unique languages. Again that is a national shame on all Americans and a tragedy to the indigenous people living in North America.

It would be another tragedy for this outcome to occur to the Tibetan people also. The loss of their culture, language, faith and religious practices. Yes, American's can relate, advise and tell China they've been there, done that and its a evil result.


Wendy X   February 24th, 2010 1:07 am ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
However Chinese don't know what tibetan says


Fred   February 24th, 2010 1:18 am ET

Hate to get off topic here but Larry's tie ROCKED tonight!


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 1:19 am ET

@ Wendy X, yes that's a good point. Any news of Tibetan atrocitys and oppression would be heavily filtered, erased and omitted in the discussions among those released to the media in the Chinese mainland. The Official State story and by-lines would be the version shipped out to the masses.

In all fairness, similar distortions routinely occur with American news media and the filtered and censored story's offered to them.


migmar   February 24th, 2010 1:28 am ET

TIBET WAS NEVER A PART OF CHINA
LONG LIVE HIS HOLINESS THE DALAI LAMA


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 1:29 am ET

Humans will never learn.


ANTHONY LAMA   February 24th, 2010 1:36 am ET

they gotto learn coz we all are interdependent .


ANTHONY LAMA   February 24th, 2010 1:47 am ET

freetibet


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 1:49 am ET

In the 1800's China claimed Korea as its own also. I guess they gave up on that 'claim' also.

What's the Chinese Govt. official talking line on China's previous claim on Korea?

Didn't the Chinese give up on that?


Dennis DeMille   February 24th, 2010 2:20 am ET

How much baby formula laced with anti-freeze have the Tibetans exported to other countries and the USA? What right does the Chinese government or their representatives have to critisize the Dalai Lama or the supressed Tibetan people? God Bless their cause and spiritualism. Jesus Christ as well as I will support them!


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 2:25 am ET

This goes way back in HISTORY I think. We all need to do some research. The internet is a good place to start. Conquests have been going on right down through the ages.

I have just been looking on the internet and I have found out that Tibet has quite a history I never knew of before until now.

----------------–

Yes, humans will probably have to learn the hard way.


Lester   February 24th, 2010 2:42 am ET

To be fair it should be the Tibetans who have the only right to choose. China is trying g to invent or remake history, the only problem is that the Tibetans won't allow the true story to be forgotten. To risk life and limbs just to shout Free Tibet or praise the Dalai Lama should be proof. I still have to meet a Tibetan that says Tibet is part of China. The only reason why China still holds Tibet is clear. It is done thru intimidation and sheer disregard of human rights and this is the current situation in regardless of which side one tends to lean on. There is no argument.


Tenzin   February 24th, 2010 2:45 am ET

It was shocking to see this post. All the people who are saying that Tibet was part of china, i jjust want to ask them few questions. If Tibet really belong to china, why is Chinese government oppressing Tibetans? Why are they discriminating between Tibetan and Chinese? Why are they not allowed keep hisholiness picture or utter his name in their home?? Why are they not teaching Tibetan language in tibet?? The answer is Tibet was never part of china that's why Chinese government is oppressing and destroying Tibetan's culture, religion and language in every possible manner. If it was part of china, they would treat Tibetan as their own people and respect our culture and religion.


alex   February 24th, 2010 2:46 am ET

The communist government which has been ruling china since 1949, i hope these young generation realise that. i hope they also know there real history...do you know that Genghis Khan is a great Mongol emperor as every other people in the world knows??? well you know him as chinese and his empire a part of chinese empire???....did you ever wonder why Great wall of china is erected???...why such a big wall on what expense and for what purpose?? why it wasn't extended towards Tibet and Mongolia???leave the ancient history,do you know that chinese representatives and army present in Tibet in 1912 were sent back to china and had major defeat???do you still elect your political leaders like any other free nation does??do you have uncensored media excess as we enjoy???do you know the chinese constitution??if you do how much is implemented on the ground level???first know your real history and then talk


youggyoung   February 24th, 2010 2:54 am ET

tibet is a part of china
there is no conference


Liz   February 24th, 2010 3:13 am ET

Don't bother listening to nor responding to the pro-China comments posted – they look and sound as though they were all posted by the same person, most likely someone working for the Chinese embassy. Tibet was an independent country and the only way China can successfully integrate Tibet into China is to start treating Tibetans with respect, which includes being honest about history and the current situation, which is that life for Tibetans in Tibet is very difficult. The Dalai Lama is a good man and he is very precious to Tibetans and to the many other people he's benefited worldwide through his spiritual teachings. I do not think it is appropriate for the Chinese government to tell the American president who he can and cannot meet, nor what issues Americans can or cannot protest about. Finally, everyone around the world can and should be concerned about human rights violations, no matter where they are occurring.


ANDY-HUANG   February 24th, 2010 3:23 am ET

in 3.14
in 7.5
why my wretch chinese be killed ,but the murderer is human rights fighter?!!!!


ZHAO TING   February 24th, 2010 3:46 am ET

AS A CHINESE, I HAVE TO SAY, IT IS OUR OWN BUSINESS!WHY DO YOU AMERICAN CARE SO MUCH ABOUT OUR BUSINESS!!SAVE IT FOR YOUR BUSINESS!!! AND PLEASE DO NOT SAY THE SAME THING AS OTHERS IF U REALLY SAY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!USE UR BRAIN AND INTELLIGENCE. TAKE CARE OF YOUR OWN AND I LOVE CHINA!


lobsang   February 24th, 2010 3:49 am ET

As a Tibetan, I know my history clearly and Tibet has never been part of shameless China. And we never want to be part of China. We showed in 2008 that we don't want live under the Chinese, whole world saw it and feel it, but the Chinese gov and the people who got tiny eyes, they didn't see it. Maybe they were busy eating rats or cats.
I can tell you a short history about China.
Millions of Chinese killed by Chairman Mao,
but Chinese gov put chairman Mao's head on their money, on the wall of Beijing Gate and forced it into people's homes too.
It was a sad story but Chinese are happy.
I can think of only one word. you must be ashamed.


Wu   February 24th, 2010 3:59 am ET

Hesse:
I am afraid that Chinese hackers in China backing by their government can do anything for their benefits.
Americans and most people in free country know how China and Chinese government is.

--------–

There's no need to unnecessarily infiltrate or hacker your poll,buddy.
Coupe of hours ago my classmates informed me about this,which is noticed earlier by many other normal Chinese netizens.
Be aware: I'll be watching you and your country. Our shared history will be written by justice. Let time justify what "precursors" like we have done.


Monique from NZ   February 24th, 2010 4:12 am ET

I am a Tibetan living in a european country after my family escaped from Tibet, into India and personally can say that Tibetans want China and Chinese OUT of Tibet, Tibet was NEVER a part of CHINA and any person with half a brain would know this, rather than believing Chinese propaganda which is total LIES.

The Dalai Lama is a man of Peace and represents us the Tibetan People he is our voice as we are unable to have our own voice.
We the world saw what happened at the Beijing Olympics with media being banned etc, What is it that China is hiding, they are too scared that the rest of the world would finally find out the TRUTH about the Tibet, china situation. What poeple wouldnt know is that many of of the Tibetans who were peacefully protesting were later brutally KILLED by the chinese which no one would know because it is covered up by the chinese government.
Since when has been acceptable to murder and kill peacful protestors, nuns, monks, destroy buddhist temples, kill and imprison MILLIONS of innocent Tibetans,
and might I ask WHERE IS OUR PANCHEN LAMA?

I strongly respect Obama for meeting with the Dalai Lama its about time!


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 4:24 am ET

@ Jessie from Auckland, NZ

The New York Times published in April 13, 2008 answered this question sometime ago for its many readers, namely that Tibet was a independent country long before China constructed its 20th-century Chinese identity of Han.

Tibet did submit to the Mongol and Manchu Empires, neither attached Tibet to China. The same documentary record that shows Tibetan subjugation to the Mongols and Manchus also shows that China’s intervening Ming Dynasty (which ruled from 1368 to 1644) had NO control over Tibet. This is very problematic, given China’s insistence that Chinese sovereignty was exercised in an unbroken line from the 13th century onward. The documentary records clearly show otherwise.

The idea that Tibet became part of China in the 13th century is a very recent construction. In the early part of the 20th century, Chinese writers generally dated the annexation of Tibet to the 18th century. They described Tibet’s status under the Qing with a term that designates a “feudal dependency,” not an integral part of a country. And that’s because Tibet was ruled as such, within the empires of the Mongols and the Manchus. When the Qing dynasty collapsed in 1911, Tibet became totally independent once more.

From 1912 until the founding of the People’s Republic of China in 1949, no Chinese government exercised ANY control over what is today China’s Tibet Autonomous Region. The Dalai Lama’s government alone ruled the land until 1951.

Marxist China adopted the linguistic sleight of hand that asserts it has always been a unitary multinational country, not the hub of empires. There is now firm insistence that “Han,” actually one of several ethnonyms for “Chinese,” refers to only one of the Chinese nationalities. This was a conscious decision of those who constructed 20th-century Chinese identity. (It stands in contrast to the Russian decision to use a political term, “Soviet,” for the peoples of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.)

There is something less to the arguments of both sides, but the argument on the Chinese side is much weaker. Tibet was not “Chinese” until Mao Zedong’s armies marched in and made it so.

Tibet WAS INDEPENDANT BEFORE Mao's armies marched on Tibet and in the future Tibet will once again be INDEPENDANT of China.


DQ   February 24th, 2010 4:32 am ET

@A. Smith, Oregon

You are not so familiar with the Chinese history.
In 1800 Korea is an independent country. The Qing Dynasty is a suzerain. Just like UK and Canada now.
But Tibet is quite different.


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 4:38 am ET

@ DQ, so China dropped its claim on Korea then? Japan entered Korea in the 1800's during the Sino-Chinese wars. Millions of Chinese troops fought against American soldiers in the Korean War on behalf of Korea.


Shi   February 24th, 2010 4:39 am ET

i'm from china. i'm nit sure what happened in Tibet exactly, but all the minorities i know at school speak their own languages,wear their own costume, and have their own religion. despite of the belief of communism of our gov, there are huge amounts of people in china are buddhists、muslims and christians, who could be seen everywhere, including both Han and other people.
How could you Americans never been to china assert that china don't respect other's religion and culture?


Zhou   February 24th, 2010 4:43 am ET

China has ZERO evidence to show that "Tibet belongs to China", besides the fabricated lies over several decades since he invasion of Tibet.

Tibet belongs to Tibetans !

I feel ashamed to see so many misinformed fellow Chinese posting Party's Lies.


Shi   February 24th, 2010 4:46 am ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
the tibetans have rights to reserve their own spoken and written language, but you say it proves that tibet does not belong to china.

but if we only teach them chinese(what is not the truth ),you would say that we are destroying tibetan culture.

you were just quibbling.

and you keep lying.


ds   February 24th, 2010 4:56 am ET

Should Tibet be an independent country? Yesterday morning Yes 88% and No 12% but at the end of the day result was like this. Yes 8% 6487No 92% 71691Total Votes: 78178
this is the truth


Shi   February 24th, 2010 4:56 am ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
Haha, you are talking about the chinese troops in korean war?
how rediculous!
your government sent soldiers to fight for the south korea in 50s, and iraq people in the past decade, and kosovo in 90s, and help europe and east asia in WW2 against the Nazi, does that mean the whole world just belongs to the US?
china was just helping a small country has the same political form as it!


Shi   February 24th, 2010 5:07 am ET

@ T
have you ever been to china? have you ever been to tibet?
how dare you talk about the status of China?
maybe we are scary, but not as scary as a country who invade into other countries, interfere other countries‘ issue, build military base on other countries' land, and hasn't signed a signature on Kyoto Protocol until today!


FF   February 24th, 2010 5:15 am ET

TIbet is an indispensable part of china !!!!!!!!!!!!
we love china !!!!
we love Tibet!!!!!!


Love China   February 24th, 2010 5:20 am ET

我是中国人,如果想看懂这些自己翻译去!我在西藏,我热爱我的祖国,而且我从小就知道别人家的事情外人少插手。达赖在我们这里是不受欢迎的,如果美国真的想展现大国风范就不要插手我们的事,因为这样只会是你们遭到谴责与鄙视,只会然你们自己更显得掉价,可笑。如果我们接见本拉登,你们会怎么想???911是你们的痛,你们很恐怖分子,那么314就是我们中国人的痛,和你们一样,我们恨达赖集团,所以请你们换位思考一下,看看你们做的是否有道德?


Love China   February 24th, 2010 5:35 am ET

还有不了解中国国情的就不要乱吼,如果我说加利福尼亚不是美国的,你怎么想?So you really understand China's history and China's 23 provinces and four municipalities, five autonomous regions, and two Special Administrative Region. 56 ethnic groups speaking after


  February 24th, 2010 6:00 am ET

哈哈,觉得印第安人应该拿回自己的领土并且独立的请举手~
谢谢,我不会英语


Peter Hood   February 24th, 2010 6:41 am ET

No one wants his family member to leave.


Ngawang Tenpa Ratutsang   February 24th, 2010 6:44 am ET

Anybody who is speaking against Dalai Lama and happened to be Chinese. I like to remind you first DO YOU HAVE FREE AND OPEN ACCESS TO INFORMATION. WHAT YOU KNOW IS WHAT IS BEING STUFF ON YOU BY THE COMMUNIST REGIME. NO FREEDOM OF SPEECH, NO RIGHT AS A PERSON EVEN NO RIGHT TO NEW IDEAS IF YOU DON'T COMPLY WITH THE HU'S GOVT. SO, BEFORE YOU CAN COMMENT ANYTHING ON TIBET OR DALAI LAMA, YOU NEED TO BE IN A FREE COUNTRY AND KNOW WHAT IS FREE PEOPLE.
I FEEL TERRIBLY SORRY FOR CHINESE PEOPLE, ALTHOUGH THEY HAVE MIND AND MOUTH BUT IT IS RESTRICTED TO SHUT UP. FREE PEOPLE DON'T ACCEPT THAT.


Jdkhjhk   February 24th, 2010 7:07 am ET

I suggestion US government donate a piece of land to Tibetan spiritual leader Dalai Lama. Don't let people hate each other or argued all the time. The only best way is help Dalai Lama is let him stay in USA because America most people trust Dalai Lama. I believed in this land everyone is very welcome Dalai Lama. So, give him whatever he wants, don't let him go back to China. We can't force China government to change their good situation.


Bai Rui   February 24th, 2010 8:14 am ET

@ Randael

Fist of all, China is not a communist country. It's goal is to become a socialist country, yet through capitalistic methods. It's government is called the Chinese Communist Party.

2ndly, may you think communism is "wrong", what you may think as the good system, democracy, your system, does not suit China and will not serve its people better than what they have now.

There are fundamental differences in the two countries, please be aware of their existence.


tenzin   February 24th, 2010 8:39 am ET

the ones who are saying tibet is a part of china, i suggest you should better look into the history! Tibet is NEVER a part of china.we are much different from the chinese..interms of our language,religion,and everything.

@Angela.How can you say tibetan nuns and monks are not murdered in tibet and the hundred years old monastries not destroyed?i know how many nuns and monks and even the lay man in tibet are murdered without any solid reason.And we are not lying. and YES chinese are compelling the tibetan students over there to learn chinese.they dont give the tibetan people in tibet the basic human rights and the lamas over there are not fully free to preach buddhism to its own people.they have captured high lamas also.example as our 5th panchen lama and tulku tenzin delek.

AND please,Tibet was nevr a province of china about 600 years ago.i dont understand from where do they bring such false information!it would be better if you get your facts correct!

free tibet!


Threbto   February 24th, 2010 8:51 am ET

All Tibetans call their country fatherland (Phayul), Chinese call theirs motherland! If they are one and the same, one of them must have had a sex change!


Bai Rui   February 24th, 2010 9:00 am ET

@ Threbto

Does your country not have its people in great diversities of cultures and languages, customs, manners, skin colors, social values, etc?


Balaanz Dagiimaa   February 24th, 2010 9:06 am ET

What is the significant there for China?

I support Dala. Someday they will be free, That time is coming soon. From Mongolia


ZZy   February 24th, 2010 9:34 am ET

A. Smith, Oregon.Nuts!Even if what your copied crap is right.So why not talking someting about the Corsica?Or even the fxxking happy life of the indian people in america blablabla


li   February 24th, 2010 9:59 am ET

Threbto

翻译问题!!!!


Hummel   February 24th, 2010 10:15 am ET

Let me ask all of you who support Tibet should be an independent country. Can you imagine what your life would be without goverment of USA?


li   February 24th, 2010 10:30 am ET

Look at the history,america belong to the indian people .......
American should take your country back to the indian people ....


DQ   February 24th, 2010 10:32 am ET

@tenzin
Ridiculous.
Tibet once established a great country called Tu Bo, but after that, it has gone with the wind. Now you share the same language, the same religion, the same currency with the chinese. Even all of the Zangs are part of the Chinese. How could you say"totally different"?

Nevermind, you can dream your own Tibet country while we are merging these two races into one in the next 50 years.

I'm glad to see that day.


Chris Philly   February 24th, 2010 10:35 am ET

Dala is joke...

he has not been in tibet for at least 30 years, maybe 40 years already...

there is huge improvement of tibet people life.... when he was in china, less than 5% tibet kids can get basic education, now more than 90% are getting educated. same with medical situation.

what dala did for tibet people is really nothing... he is just fooling around to get money from the western world. he is used as a tool against China, that is so obvious to everybody....


DQ   February 24th, 2010 10:38 am ET

@Balaanz Dagiimaa

mongolia, the scar on Chinese.....

Ironically, It is still included in China on the Republic of China(Taiwan)'s map.

Hope oneday Mongolia will be part of our country again, just like inner mongolia.


Shi   February 24th, 2010 10:52 am ET

@tenzi,in the history, the US is never a nation but colonies belong to several different european countries. doues it mean nowadays the US is still not a country itself?


Shi   February 24th, 2010 10:59 am ET

@Monique from NZ
i have seen your banchan lama on tv and magazine covers for several times, addressing speech to the public and showing up in documentary. do you people capture prisoners in such a free way?

also, how could you say that a man who has away from tibet for more than half a century and have never come back is telling the truth about tibet in today?


michael   February 24th, 2010 11:00 am ET

Just look from where Americans get their so-called "international news" and they everybody can get a clear picture why there are so many biased and ignorant Americans! Most Americans get their "international related information either from CNN, mainstream American media or BBC which obviously shares the very similar viewpoints with CNN regarding China, Russia, Asia, Mid-east and other non-western nations or regions. Yet Americans think that they know the absolutely truth about the world only through these two information sources?! Almost laughable! I always wonder why CNN and other u.s. media are so afraid of letting American public to hear different opinions? We see Chinese media broadcast American presidents' speech in China, but we never hear full coverage of any visiting Chinese presidents' speech in U.S.! Oh yes, there is the Internet and people can get online to know different opinions, but how many Americans know Chinese language well enough to be able to read their opinions? How many Americans are ACTIVELY seeking different viewpoints? And how many Americans possess good critical thinking skills to be able to make correct judgement?

I see several self-claimed "Tibetans" here to support DL, but evern you're a real member in theTibetan ethnicity, I'm sure that you're from former slave owners' families and your, like your fathers or grandfathers, must miss those good and comfortable days in Tibet decades ago when your families enjoyed wealth and services from your slaves. Americans must know that not many Chinese Tibetans can write in English or can write English as well as these a few we see here! Anyway, I understand a few self-claimed Tibetans frustrations and anger because it does not feel too good to be beggers even though Dalai and you have been living on CIA paychecks and the west anti-China organizations for decades plus having received unconditional support from mainstream west media.

By the way, CNN and some Americans, please don't rape world's public opinions when you utter the word and phrases such as "the world" or "the international community". The world is much much bigger than U.S./a few major west nations, and the international community certtainly includes over 1.3 billion Chinese people and people in the non-west world!

When Dalai travelled to Taiwan last year, thousands of Taiwaneses held a huge anti-Dalai demonstration and people shouted at him to "Get out of our place!" Why CNN and other major media kept very quite on it and didn't have big coverage of this news?


cedric   February 24th, 2010 11:23 am ET

American!!Pls Remmember: Who gave you the best assistance when you were strand in the Eco depression?


Shi   February 24th, 2010 11:23 am ET

americans never understand what a role Dalai Lama plays in tibet.
first, he is not a president or some others elected by people. he is considered as a living buddha since he is ever born. people believed that his status is decided by the gods. and, he will never lose his power and influence until he die.
second, after a Dalai Lama's death, people belive his heir will be showed via oracle. they will choose an heir from newly-borned infants,who are said to be the dead Dalai Lama's reincarnation. and then the months old little kid will take control of tiebet.
so, Dalai Lama is never a politician serves the tibetan people. he is a religious symbol. is the Pope a qualitified leader on political issues?
No.
americans encorage building a theocratic nation in tibet, while they accuse that China is not democratic enough.
what a good solution!


vince   February 24th, 2010 11:32 am ET

where the hell did you learn history? Tibet has been part of China even before the US was founded.
How about you Americans return the land to Indians (native Americans)?


Shi   February 24th, 2010 11:36 am ET

it's good to see sb mentioned Banchan Lama, another religious idol in tibet, who pocesses the equal power to Dalai, however, stayed in China until he died and taken place by his young heir via a formal-standardized religious ceremony.
if Dalai is a brave man fight for humanities as you americans say, and escaped from china with millions of tibetans, why didn't Banchan leave with him? why he has never succeed in rescuring Banchan from the so-called capture?
it's obviously that there are disagreements between the two Lamas. Maybe its about whether tibet should be still under the control of a reliqious leader.


michael   February 24th, 2010 11:39 am ET

Does CNN, major u.s. media and some Americans understand this hard reality? That is:

The more open China becomes, the more Chinese people know mainstream u.s. media, the LESS love they have to you! Chinese public had a much positive opinion on u.s. media 30 years ago. Now you don't have much credibility and moral authority in China due to your own disgraceful behaviours! In fact, the history will notice that the year of 2008 was a turning point regarding Chinese people's, particularly young Chinese people's viewpoints (negtive) about u.s. media. It would be very naive and stupid if Larry King and other American journalists really believe Dalai Lama's lies. Keep on burrying your heads in sand and continueing to daydream and live in your delisions. It seems that China has changed and Chinese people have been moving forward for 3 decades, yet most media people in u.s. still lived in the past.


Francisco   February 24th, 2010 12:27 pm ET

those who can just defame one he never truly get to know is arrogant and savage ,it shows that he has never have enough practice of democracy so he's not qualified as a modern citizen even he's born in a so-called free country.Don't be blind because what you know and heard from your government


Tib Youth   February 24th, 2010 12:33 pm ET

A statement that Chinese Embassy has made clearly showned that how much they hate 'The 14th Dalai Lama of Tibet'. In fact, they are burning inside and about to blast when they really see "Tibet as a Independence country" one day and i promise that day is never not so far!!!!

And People I highly request to you that please be side of truth n support Tibet!!!!


Zhi Hong   February 24th, 2010 12:55 pm ET

Tibetans are ethnically not Chinese, being of older genetic stock (sorry). They speak their own language and have their own religion. They aren't Chinese any more than the people of Palau are the Americans who occupy them. Tibetans were setting off fireworks to celebrate the Dalai Lama's visit to Obama, eventhough the news was suppressed by official Chinese government censors. We could see it freely in the US.

The last time I was in (Tibetan) Lithang, the PRC military had police with guns on the roof watching everyone who visited the Buddhist stupa. I saw them check the cameras of tourists who looked in their direction. They had military troups all over. My American husband had children show them the Dalai Lama medallions they hid under their clothing. We couldn't get to Lhasa because the government closed it down. That isn't the sign of an open government.

When I was in China I couldn't google Dalai Lama or get open information about Tibet. The government had shut down free access. Americans can watch Al Jazeera on television but China is afraid of open information even on the internet. So how do you fellow Chinese know what the DL is like? Have you ever seen the videos on Phayul? The DL isn't a splittist like they say, but those who come after he is dead will probably be.

Yes this is like the treatment by Americans of the Indians which destroyed many of those cultures. Do we really want China to act like that?


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 12:58 pm ET

@ Michael

Ah, you remind me of an American! You must be on the F-1 visa. You extrapolate information drawn from these blogs and “assume” Americans all are synonymous… Is that not what you criticize Americans for? And yet, you do the same! You do not take into consideration that some Americans have lived in China or Tibet! Many American’s ancestry is from China. Yet, you lump them all into a bowl of ‘chow fan’ Do Americans profess that they know all? No! This is your anger speaking.

The threads that connect Tibet and China are woven throughout time. The wounds run deep, the blood flows like a river carpeting the land. One must examine all the layers and take a position of neutrality in order to see with clarity.


Huang   February 24th, 2010 1:55 pm ET

Hello, the world.
Whether Tibet is part of China, everybody can check the history and have a say. Tibet has long been a province of China since Han Dynasty(do u know Han? thousands of yrs ago that AMERICA even not existed on this world!). Yes, I agree with the point that Tibet has its own religion, culture and tradition. We respect them. Can you say that Indians has their own culture, own language and u American do nothing good on them, so u regard Indian Tripes as a independent country?
U'r promoting the spirit of " Democracy" all over the world. However,is there real democracy existing in America? Please mind your own business!
Probably some measures of China government seems not so proper in your eyes. We may not love the party,but we Chinese must love our country! All attached with Tibet is our interior affairs . U, the so-called "democratic" country, please go head to eliminate your discrimination on African-Americans or other things first!


wmj   February 24th, 2010 1:57 pm ET

politics!what r u!y u mess this!
some sweetiee say chinese govrnment force eveybody 2 speak chinese.but god know the truth.
dude!WE call ur "chinese" "Mandarin". in our way.no matter Tibetan or Mandarin,they r different kinds of chinese spoken by different ehinic groups,they belongs to chinese.common sense may have not told u that ehinic han is the largest one among all chinese ehinic groups.right,han speak mandarin.so...
ha!idalailalalal say place A has larger population than place B,then obamamama say'oh!A leader is forcing B 2 become one of B'maybe i'm not so logical.but in my eyes,the sweetiee's logic is not so logical too!
i suppose u r wise nation.
as an equal soul in this world,i rly appreciate america's advance.it's all from ur hard work.i like ur special,vivid expressing way,which sometimes amuse me when i enjoy ur moveis which is a kinda reflection of ur true life.i am intereted in ur country and wanna know more about ur,my friends' world,and hope we can be friends.so in a word i think u should make ur comment based on relatively subjective view.don't be so sure about one thing.sometimes u should deep down its past.china is 5000 yrs old,a lot of things are not able to make a conclusion by reading only a few papers.i beleve deep down in ur heart,u have justice and u all wish world develop healthily and peacefully,which requires us to be cautious when we draw a conclusion.i bet u know something about a wound not able to heal.
chinese younger generation r totally free 4 to choose which kind of language they wanna learn.including Tibetan nationality and han nationality,china has other 54 nationality.chinese govrnment would not interfere each's living habits.what's more we value each.as to the fact of minority of tibetan speakers and the decreasing number of tibetan speakers,chinese govnment is making measures to protect tibetan activly.


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 2:12 pm ET

@ Huang

Han is also the majority in China. You must be Han! You also have 55 ethnic minority groups within China too! Hans are like the white man in the US. Hans often do not want to marry into minority groups. They prefer to stay within their own ethnic group.


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 2:19 pm ET

Good Morning Gerald!

Nice to see you blogging today! :~)


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 2:22 pm ET

@ wmj

Ah, lesson to be learned. I should refresh the browser before clicking on that red little button at the bottom that states "submit comment" I see I have repeated some of your blog and possibly made an error. I thought there were 55 minority groups in China. You denoted 54! I assume, my mistake!


passing by   February 24th, 2010 3:00 pm ET

Michae wrote:

--------------------------------
February 24th, 2010 11:39 am ET

Does CNN, major u.s. media and some Americans understand this hard reality? That is:

The more open China becomes, the more Chinese people know mainstream u.s. media, the LESS love they have to you! Chinese public had a much positive opinion on u.s. media 30 years ago. Now you don't have much credibility and moral authority in China due to your own disgraceful behaviours! In fact, the history will notice that the year of 2008 was a turning point regarding Chinese people's, particularly young Chinese people's viewpoints (negtive) about u.s. media. It would be very naive and stupid if Larry King and other American journalists really believe Dalai Lama's lies. Keep on burrying your heads in sand and continueing to daydream and live in your delisions. It seems that China has changed and Chinese people have been moving forward for 3 decades, yet most media people in u.s. still lived in the past.
-------------------------------–

I posted Michael's comment again here because that is exactly how I feel about the american media these days. Often when americans argue about China related issues with me, they always make me feel that they know better about the country's problems than I do. But I am a chinese who have lived in US for 14 years, go back to visit my parents in Beiing EVERY summer, communicate in both Chinese and English fluently and read news both chinese and american newspapers. (– well I must point it out here that I could not keep reading the western ones any more because 90% of their coverage about China are false beyond my basic comprehension. I think it has to be because that 's the only way for those poor journalists to get their whatever published to earn some money. ) I do all those but still, those americans think whatever I tell them about China is just wrong or I am just brainwashed. One post said all chinese posts here were written by one or two individules because they sounded alike. Let me tell you, that's because the real chinese all feel the similar way about this issue. Chinese goverment is really doing a great job in Tibet. Why can't you guys just believe in that. There are always people that couldn't get what they want in any society. Dalai is one of them because he used to be the biggest slavery master in Tibet and lost all that power and money and he could not come to terms with it. Fighting for the tibetan people and the Nobel prize winner? What a JOKE! Search for his bowl made of his slave's skull on youtube. Go get shocked!! @ A Smith , prove I am wrong. I could find you equal amount of people who benefit very well with the present situation in Tibet and love their lives right now. What if they don't agree with you and don't want Dalaiback? they won't count for Tibetans? So like I have said many times to my friends, the tibetans and the han chinese have lived in the region for so many years. They have communities and families for so long. They can only work together and move forward. There is no way back for them. The jews will stay in the middle east and looks like no americans are willing to go back to europe or africa or wherever else since you got the land from the natives. They are done deals. Looks like the chinese are making a better world in Tibet for everybody but some people here just don't want to see that happen!!


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 3:25 pm ET

@ passing by

I find it quite interesting that the behaviors you detest and despise, you emulate! An analogy would be my 'passing by' the CCTV blog and post a comment to your country like the one you posted above! The youth of China is becoming the mirror image of the youth in the US. A dichotomy in the purest sense!


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 3:33 pm ET

@ Zhi Hong, thank-you for joining us. You don't sound like you are working for the Chinese Govt. being paid to blog here.

You bring up several good points:

1) China has Tibetan internet access filtered and blocked, mainland Chinese are only fed the Chinese talking State line on Tibet and nothing else.

2) Chinese secret police photographing and filming those that show interest in the Buddhist temples and those visitors to them.
The Tibetan people come from a older genetic gene pool. They speak their own language, have their own calendar and have their own religion. They aren't Chinese any more than the people of Palau are the Americans who occupy them. Tibetans were setting off fireworks to celebrate the Dalai Lama's visit to Obama, even though the news was suppressed by official Chinese government censors.

3) Chinese are unable to even Google The Dalai Lama, their views and speaking points are merely echos of the Chinese State hard liners.

Return Independence back to Tibet, Free Tibet from the oppression by the Chinese secret service and state police.


yifanker   February 24th, 2010 3:35 pm ET

well said, Gerald Jolly!
People are NOT that different. The wrong perception is often from media like CNN.


Pasang   February 24th, 2010 3:40 pm ET

TIBET MUST BE FREE

Tibet must be free, not just for the six million Tibetans,
But also for the six billion world's humanity including Han Chinese...

A glimpse of Tibet: Past and Present
Tibet, our motherland, is popularly known as ‘Roof of the World’ and ‘Heartland of Asia’. Approximately, 40-60 million years ago, before the formation of the plateau of Tibet, the area was occupied by the Teethes Sea. Gradually, physical collusion between the Asian mainland and the Indian subcontinent began which led to the crust of the earth being pushed up to form one new beautiful land in this world as what we call TIBET today.

Tibet was a sovereign, theocratic and independent country prior to the illegitimate Chinese invasion on the dawn of October 6, 1951. Sun had witnessed it. So did moon, stars and the entire universe. No one can deny this – truth is truth. Tibet had its national anthem or hymn called “In the kingdom surrounded by snow mountains”, which was composed in way back to 1745 by the Tibetan ruler Pholanas. Similarly, Tibet had its national flag since 1916 adapted from an older 7th century snow lion standard of the Tibetan Emperor, Songtsen Gampo. Whereas, over 90% of the flags of member-states in the UNO were emanated after World War II only, including the present national flag of China. Further, there are ample of historical evidences like old Tibetan currency notes, treaties, passports, postal stamps, stone pillar in Jhokhang Temple and many more to admit the truth. Wasn’t Tibet an independent country earlier? Seek truth from facts – true facts, not false facts.

After the failure of Mass Uprising on March 10, 1959, His Holiness the Dalai Lama fled to India in exile followed by 80,000 Tibetans. Some found way to Nepal while some to Bhutan. However, majority of the people settled here in India. Since then, Tibetans began their freedom struggle in and outside Tibet under the leadership of His Holiness. At present, we have over one and a half lakh Tibetans living in exile.

Despite all the historical facts of Tibet as an independent country in the past, His Holiness turned to seek mere genuine autonomous for future Tibet by publicly announcing the Strasbourg Proposals in June 1988 considering the sensitivity and urgency of the present scenario. Today our exile community consists of two groups – one in the allegiance to Middle Path policy for genuine autonomy while other adamantly seeking complete independence, which is our birth right.

Notwithstanding all the differences in approach, our goal is one and the same i.e. reunification of six million Tibetan brethren. We share common dream of free Tibet where all the Tibetan people can live with freedom, equality and dignity preserving, protecting and promoting our precious religion, culture and ethos.

Why Free Tibet for World Peace and Prosperity?
Tibet must be free, not just for the six million Tibetans, but also for the six billion world's humanity including Han Chinese. For the long-run national security and social stability of China, local Tibetans and Han Chinese must be treated equally status quo, which is not happening under current Chinese Communist leadership. However, this will be only possible when Tibetans are governed by Tibetans themselves and Chinese are governed by Chinese themselves. Even genuine national autonomy can serve this purpose keeping independence aside. Continuous deprivation of Tibetan people from fundamental political, social, economic and religious rights will further increase the resentment in the heart and mind of Tibetans. That will result to more negative repercussions in both the communities emasculating one another from the destabilization of the government to disruption of harmonious society. Ultimately, in the long run, it can potentially risk the very survival of the People’s Republic China not only in Tibet, but also in its own mainland.

In fact, the current Communist government is surviving with the use of military muscle and economic power. There is no confidence of the mass people to the government. Even for the celebration of the 60th Anniversary of the formation of their Communist Regime, they welcomed only drafted citizens for the celebration, blocked so many web blogs, restricted open media coverage and patrolled heavy armed policemen all around with the fear of festivities turning fiasco. Freedom of life is not there. Life of every individual is directed by the State from the words one speaks to the newspaper one reads. Choices are few; compulsions are more. Therefore, there are many Chinese people who want democratic form of government. With those Chinese people also, we share common dream – a dream of freedom of life and liberty.

Beijing has unresolved territorial disputes over land or sea borders with countries ranging geographically from India and North Korea to Indonesia, not to mention its outright claim to Taiwan.
India spends more than 63 crores everyday for Sino-India border security. Just recently, this year, they intruded inside the international border between India (Himachal Pradesh) and China by 1.5 Km and occupied the no man’s land. Similarly, they even intruded in Ladakh and wrote “China” in red letter on number of rocks which fall under Indian territory. They are still claiming 90,000 sq.Km of Arunachal Pradesh (almost full portion of that state), where India suffered heavy blow in Sino-Indian conflict 1962. India never had any border dispute with Tibet since time immemorial before the Chinese occupation. Currently, the border dispute between India and China is simmering which can only be resolved when the issue of Tibet is resolved. Otherwise, no talk will walk.

The issues that divide India and China, however, extend beyond territorial disputes. Water is becoming a key security issue in Sino-India relations and a potential source of future discord. Even though India has more arable land than China, Tibet is the source of most major Indian rivers. Six major Asian rivers arise from the Tibetan plateau — the Indus, Mekong, Brahmaputra, Salween, Yangtze and Yellow River. China has plans to build several hydroelectric plants on Tibet's rivers and export power to its cities. In future, China will use water as a political weapon. The most dangerous idea China is contemplating is the northward rerouting of the Brahmaputra River, known as Yarlung Tsangpo in Tibetan. It is the world’s highest river, and also one of the fastest-flowing. This project implies environmental devastation of India’s north-eastern plains and eastern Bangladesh, and would thus be akin to a declaration of ‘water war’ on India and Bangladesh. The issue now is not WHETHER China will reroute the Brahmaputra, but WHEN. Once authorities complete their feasibility studies and the diversion scheme begins, the project will be presented as a fait accompli.

By annexing Tibet, China virtually began to gain strong political and economic influence in Pakistan, Nepal, Bhutan, East Turkistan (Xijiang), Burma and even India. Today, Pakistan, Nepal and Burma are highly under the direct influence of China. The influence of Communist China gave rise to Maoist party in Nepal overthrowing constitutional Monarchy system and Burmese people being suppressed by the Burmese Communist regime, a puppet of China. The centuries-old relation of Nepal with New Delhi is now shifting towards Beijing. China is encouraging Pakistan to enhance nuclear proliferation by supplying nuclear technology and uranium to them. Now, India is having two threatening enemies at its doorstep – one open, but suppressible and the other silent, but disastrous.

Thus, for the eternal peace and prosperity in Southern Asia, particularly between the two Asian giants, Tibet as a buffer zone is once again needed. This is the only lasting answer to this crux.
Moreover, excessive population transfer, deforestation, minerals mining and dumping nuclear wastes are going on there in Tibetan plateau in very large scale endangering the wildlife species and polluting the fresh air, pristine mountains and rivers. It’s not only a threat to the Tibetans people living inside Tibet, but also to the livelihood of over a billion people dependent on the major river systems of Asia. Certainly, it also adds fuel to the fire of global warming or climate change.

Bridging diplomatic relation with China by the world leaders to overcome the economic crisis is appreciable. But, equally, it is an inevitably important and urgent to bring China under the mainstream of democracy so that perpetual peace and prosperity will prevail throughout the world. Champions of democracy like USA, UK, France, Germany and India must play a pivotal role in this matter substantively. Otherwise, giant Dragon of China which is growing up with us will one day dictate the terms to all of us and spew fire on those who disobey to the ashes. That’s why I always define communist of China as “government of the terror, by the terror and for the terror”. (Here, all the three terrors are PRC only) Better safe than sorry!

To end, let me remind you once and for all that Tibet must be free, not just for the six million Tibetans, but also for the six billion world's humanity including Han Chinese. Let Snow Lion of Tibet be there in between mammoth Elephant and giant Dragon as in the past.
Let us free Tibet! Free Tibet for World Peace and Prosperity!
Bhod-gyallo!

Pasang Tsering (LL.B., III-year)
MS Ramaiah College of Law, Bangalore


Fei   February 24th, 2010 3:44 pm ET

Wow how typical of all the Pro Chinese Government here are posting VERY VERY WEAK ARGUMENTS !

I am a Chinese and i Love my country But that does not mean I love my government because it is a Single Party Government and it's only goal is to Keep Power and Money within its Party circle.

LOVE MY CHINA BUT HATES CHINESE GOVERNMENTS PITIFUL PROPAGANDA !


Fei   February 24th, 2010 3:48 pm ET

One more thing.

To A. Smith, Oregon: You do realize that you are talking to some paid CCP commenters and rest who are just blindly Nationalistic !

FREE TIBET !
FREE CHINA !


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 4:09 pm ET

The Chinese hardliners writing here have stated China openly accepts religious organizations, values and there are Catholic, Buddhist and other temples openly observing their faiths thru-out China.

The US State Dept. strongly disagrees as do many of the Tibetan bloggers and followers of those religions whose followers were rounded up, savagely beaten and imprisoned.

US State Dept. 2000 Report on Religious oppression in China:

U.S. State Department said that in the past year China had intensified its repression against the Falun Gong, Tibetan Buddhists, Muslim Uighurs, and underground Protestants and Catholics. Some Chinese religious believers, the report said, face "harassment, extortion, prolonged detention, physical abuse, and incarceration in prison or in ‘re-education through labor’ camps."

Christianity Today magazine reports the arrests of another 53 Protestants, all members of a house church movement called the China Evangelistic Fellowship. Chinese police ransacked and closed a Bible school held in a home in Hubei province and arrested 35 students and teachers. Eleven members of the church were arrested in neighboring Henan province, and seven leaders were detained in Shaanxi province, north of Hubei.

The Vatican news agency Fides reports that newly appointed auxiliary bishop Jiang Ming Yuan of Hebei province, a member of the underground church, was detained. Fides said two other bishops from Hebei have been missing since Chinese police detained them in 1996.


Takeiteasy!   February 24th, 2010 4:41 pm ET

All those Chinese who voted and voted on CNN about if Tibet should be an independent country are here shouting slogans of I LOVE CHINA. It is great that you love your country but do a little bit of research beyond what your government tells you and dismiss anything Tibetans or Dalai Lama has to say. Doing that makes you sound stubborn, stupid, ignorant and most importantly SCARED to learn the truth and to be proven wrong.

If Tibet is really a part of China, how come none of the Chinese people I have met in the last 10-15 of my stay in US (some extremely nice people and friends of mine) never called me their own when I said I am a Tibetan? Without any prior knowledge of if I am for or against Tibetan indepence and so on. I think Chinese people on this blog are fooling themselves and readers if they say they consider Tibetans as their own. We have NEVER EVER been Chinese and will never be, no matter if you kill, torture, force us to learn Chinese, or destroy our monastries. The sooner China faces the reality the better it is for them, this is not an issue that is going away.

TIBET WILL BE FREE. Even if it takes many more generations and another million lives, we will fight for it.


FREE TIBET   February 24th, 2010 4:46 pm ET

Why does the Chinese government censor everything if they dont have anything to hide?
Are they afraid of underaged kids watching porn?
Chinese people don't even have the rights to elect their own leaders.
FREE TIBET


Dodie   February 24th, 2010 4:52 pm ET

@ Fei

You stated:

"I am a Chinese and i Love my country But that does not mean I love my government because it is a Single Party Government and it's only goal is to Keep Power and Money within its Party circle."

---------–

You are very wise to see that within your government! All governments around the world, including mine, spew propaganda in order to keep order within their country and the government stable. The media is part of the process because their backing comes from large government, corporate or religious interests... in other words... big money!

You are a visionary!


SW   February 24th, 2010 5:14 pm ET

To A. Smith, Oregon.

History appears to entirely show that US did NOT exist before massive immigration and slaughtered native americans. It is not hard to learn the Native American population before and how many survived today. When US government talks about human rights to other countries, it's nothing but a joke, they are joking themselves. Who killed those Native Americans, who did the slave business? Not many years ago, women and black people didn't even have right to vote. I don't know who has the right to talk about human rights, but I do know who is least qualified - US. If you know little abut what US had done and is doing in the world, you will easily get the conclusion that US is the most immoral country in today's world.


Tibet, Tibet, Tibet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   February 24th, 2010 5:30 pm ET

Tibet
Roof of the world
Earth's purest
sources of rivers
land of wild yaks,antelopes and medicinal herbs
peoples with pure faith in truth and purity

Please don't strangle our innocent
Please don't delude our sky and earth
Please stop raping our hapiness and welbeing
How much I tries to convince myself
I don't agree with you
I belive I have right for being a human being and a Tibetan

my Chinese brothers
please ,
understand me
look at me and see me
It is so painful when you make me invisible and you don't want to see me.

Tibet, Tibet, Tibet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I


Liz Bosman   February 24th, 2010 5:38 pm ET

If China proclames they are just helping the Tibitens, why do they arrest or shoot at Tibitens trying to leave the country?. Why does China have so many poltical prisoners and arrest so many "citizens" who speak out for the Dalai Lama? Where is the Panchen Lama (who was found by the Dalai Lama) and his family? And how can China select their own Panchen Lama, when China doesn't even support The Dalai Lama?
Tibet is Tibet. And China's goverment is a military aggressior!


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 5:42 pm ET

@ Pasang, its refreshing to actually hear from Tibetans on this issue. I'm surprised that China would send so many of its servants to explain their party lines here and for the Chinese Govt. to submit a talking lines review to Larry King after his interview with the Dalai Lama!

Free Tibet from the Chinese Oppression, Independence for Tibet!


Tibet, Tibet, Tibet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   February 24th, 2010 5:51 pm ET

yes, you have money , tall buildings and military
you find pride , power in them
I respect you and I salute you

likewise
we have purest rivers, ancient mountains and a pieace of last innocence
please let us find a trival pride and solace in these things

please understand me and see me.


lazyk   February 24th, 2010 6:24 pm ET

dalai lama is seeking autonomy not independence, even though i know the tibetan youths today such as TYC might have other expectation. so why is china not accepting this proposal of autonomy (tibet staying under china)? it sounds like a very good deal. right?


larry   February 24th, 2010 6:28 pm ET

dalai lama is seeking autonomy not independence, even though i know the tibetan youths today such as TYC might have other expectation. so why is china not accepting this proposal of autonomy (tibet staying under china)? it sounds like a very good deal.. right?


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 7:06 pm ET

@ A.Smith, Oregon

Good points you made.

================

I think this problem could go way back in history. We need to research it.


Trish   February 24th, 2010 7:07 pm ET

@ Dodie–someone asked you what type of work you do yesterday–I don't know if you answered it. I'm interested too. I hope you don't find it too an invasive question or personal.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 7:15 pm ET

@ namdol February 23rd, 2010 10:22 pm ET

Beautiful comments by you.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 7:40 pm ET

@ A. Smith, Oregon February 24th, 2010 4:24 am ET

Thankyou for this information. I was actually trying to look for a good map of Tibet on the internet and came across other information saying that Tibet had it's own ruling dynasty of Kings. This article I found had a lot of information on Tibetian History.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 7:45 pm ET

I think Dodie could be involved in Social Work by the sounds of it.


Mimi G.   February 24th, 2010 7:46 pm ET

It is amazing to read some of these pro-china comments, most of them just blindly & roboticly stating one liner "Tibet has always been a part of China", "Tibetans are one of the many ethnic groups in China", " I love China".

I don't doubt you love China, one should love and be proud of their own country, but one also needs to acknowledge the truth. I applaud Fei and Zhi Hong, true Chinese, to be able to openly acknowledge the flaws of Communist Chinese Gov't. Their honesty is commendable. China is all about showing power, control & greed. For example: 2008 Olympic in Beijing. What lengths they would go to show how great & grand China is. Pretty sad. The opening ceremony – using a fake singer, and other fake special effects. Unbelievable, but not surprised.

Tibet is NOT a part of China. I'm not just talking about the difference in our language & culture, we have our very own national flag, our own national anthem (still do). We had our own governmental system, our own currency. Tibet was greedily and brutally taken by China simply because they had the means to do so, without any regard for human rights, and because of Tibet's convenient location. China didn't have to look too far to make room for the billion Chinese.

To those Chinese who don't know how Tibet became so called "a part of China" is when China first started to eye Tibet for its land space, rich in natural resources (untouched mountains and trees).

First step was to offer help build road from Beijing leading into Tibet, which Tibet happily & innocently accepted. This gave the perfect opportunity for China to send truck loads of Chinese troops & military into Tibet, over powering the unprepared Tibetans, and the rest is history.

Next step, slowly & steadily erase the culture and the Tibetan people by building the railway system from Beijing into Tibet, making it easier for more Han Chinese to migrate into Tibet. Mission accomplished, now Tibetans are a minority in thier own land. China has very conveniently re-written history, and now claims Tibet has always been a part of China. No shame.

Nepal is the next target. They are doing the very same there, first the financial help to build railway, then migrate Han Chinese. Next thing you know , China will take over and then claim that Nepal was always a part of China. It's all about power and greed – very sad. They have taken Tibet by force & intimidation, but must you now continue to toruture the Tibetans in Tibet, take away their basic human rights, and also erase the rich Tibetan culture, language, religion and their way of life? "Karma" is a very powerful thing in Tibetan Buddhism. MimiG


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 7:48 pm ET

Dodie you sound quite knowledgeable too and I like reading your comments. Have you travelled quite a bit too.


Gerald Jolly   February 24th, 2010 8:07 pm ET

Hey folks, about Dodie.

I hope she wont get angry, but Dodie is a phsycologist of the first order, terribly intelligent and a fantastic human being.

All of us on this blog could learn much from her.

Yes she is world travelled and has done more for ex-vets through her wonderfull councelling.

Dodie, please dont be angry at me for exposing your wonderfullness


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 8:16 pm ET

@ Tibet, sadly China is planning on a huge river diversion that flows thru Tibet, which would likely lead to drastic decreases in water flowing to India and other parts of Tibet. I'm certain the highest rivers in the world in Tibet are beautiful, look at them and enjoy them, apparently all of that is going to change soon thanks to Chinese interference in Tibet's natural resources.

Compared to the extremely poisonous rivers filled with toxic cadmium chemical wastes in China that have a distinct yellow color, I'm certain the rivers in Tibet appear to be rather pristine.


Trish   February 24th, 2010 8:19 pm ET

@ Gerald Jolly–thanks for answering the question. Here frequently we're posting & have no idea who 's in the group,where they come from, how old they are–etc.,etc,


Gerald Jolly   February 24th, 2010 8:22 pm ET

@ A. Smith Oregon

C'mon guy, you and I both know that the chinese folks blogging on this subject are "NOT" "NOT" plants by the chinese government.

C'mon, you're more intelligent than that.

It's fine to comment on your point of view on issues, but you are doing exactly what you are acquesing the chinese government of doing.

Propagandizing, innuendo, false statements, is what you are doing to make a point that I'm sorry to say, you know little about.

You and I both know, that you have never travelled to China or Tibet, or experienced either one of those cultures so making statements that are unfounded and untrue, only will expose you to the riducule of others that know about that culture.

If you are quoting from a magazine article or a story book written by an obviously biased writer, you only re-inforce everybody's opinion that you are just ranting about something you know nothing about.

Finally, please just do the equation, and compare.

KENT STATE U.S.A. 7 young college students killed for protesting against the Vietnam War and the Draft

Versus

Tianemen Square 1 Chinese student protesting against a government policy resolution.


DQ   February 24th, 2010 8:39 pm ET

@Fei

左粪五毛固然可恶,右粪五美分党更令人不齿。
你这样自以为很清醒的人实则很可悲。
明实亡于东林党争,希望以史为鉴。
无论从民族情感还是实际利益上来看,西藏必须是中国的一部分。


migmar   February 24th, 2010 8:45 pm ET

TIBET BELONG TO TIBETANS


ANDY-HUANG   February 24th, 2010 8:54 pm ET

I thought that the United States is free, but yesterday I was sent here three comments, only through a speech.
so who will belive CNN is free?


james   February 24th, 2010 8:55 pm ET

"Tianemen Square 1 Chinese student protesting against a government policy resolution."

Gerald, which planet are you from? There were thousands out there on that day at TS. Do you need me to show you the pictures, videos?


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 9:05 pm ET

The Chinese Govt. gave Larry King their talking points after Larry Kings interviewed with the Dalai Lama, that is the very article which began this blog.

Meanwhile hundreds of Chinese Govt. bloggers hijacked the CNN vote on the question of the CNN viewers regarding if Tibet should become independent of China.

It's obvious the Chinese Govt. pays bloggers to supplement its State Line to their masses. American special interest groups do the very same thing, they have their own websites, blogs, visit and post on other blogs all at the same time being paid by a 3rd. party to tout their hype and lobbying theme.

What I find interesting is that the Chinese Govt's internet filter and censor controls prevents Chinese people from evening finding out more about the Dalai Lama themselves, other than of course the State Line which is the same taught in the Chinese re-education labor camps to those that forget what the State Line is.

Arresting anyone for wearing or having a photo of the Dalai Lama? That certainly appears to be FACT and ongoing in Tibet and in China also.

And yet the Chinese Govt. bloggers keep stating Tibetans love China, they have religious freedom and are prospering!

None of the Tibetans I have spoken with here in Oregon loves China at all, None of them speak fondly of their country being invaded and hijacked by the Chinese military, their temples burned, monks shot and killed.

Tibet was independent and China should get out of Tibet so Tibet can have Independence again.

Free Tibet!


Shi   February 24th, 2010 9:06 pm ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
you stupid
it's obviously that the Zhi Hong has left china and join Dalai Lama.
i'm a student, not paid by my government, and not a communist at all.
and Tibet is a part of China.
my mother, a common university teacher, has been to tibet recent years to taught them technologies. apparently, the tibet she saw is toatally different from what you say. and the environment is not damaged, but protected by the loacal government, which mainly constructed of local tibetans.
and how dare you mention the yellow river?
it has been yellow for thousands of years, and just like mississippi, it's the yellow river, feed chinese people for thousand years.
the color is a geologic problem, not an industrial one.
also, the government is doing sth on it to make up for destructions.


Theresa   February 24th, 2010 9:14 pm ET

&@ Gerald Jolly –what I read about Tianemman Square was that 3000 people were killed or injured. I can remember seeing the tank rolling down the street running over a young man.After the foreign press were exiled from China.Tanks cleared the square of people,arrests were made. It initially started as a peaceful protest. People originallywent to Tianneman Square on the eve of the funeral of a pro dem. HuYaobang. 100,000 met @Tianneman Square. The peaceful protests lasted 7 wk. The gov't' became upset & then the massacre happened. I still remember seeing news about it. The gov't. now makes it as if it was an insignificant thing. I'm certain the older generation are too afraid to talk about it. The younger generation believe what the gov't. want them to know. I've never lived in China so, this is what I assume.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 9:17 pm ET

Thank you for all the comments here and the enlightenment it has given on this subject matter. Good to hear the different points of views.


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 9:20 pm ET

@ Shi, right and what is your 'non-official Chinese State line' on what happened at Tianemman Square and why so many protesters were murdered there?

The Yellow River? No, I stated the poison's chemical Cadmium used by China to mass produce Cadmium Battery's had polluted several rivers in China which now have a distinct Yellow color from the hyper-toxic Cadmium wastes dumped into them.

@ Shi, haven't you heard of all the health problems there in China from the Cadmium wastes in some of the river water?


Shi   February 24th, 2010 9:23 pm ET

and let me tell you what has happened to the votes.
when i get up and use a local website Renren, which is just like facebook, there are many articles and comments about your votes, mostly written by my friends, who are students in the US, and surely not paid by the gov, for some of them even opposite the gov.
however, everyone is calling for friends vote for NO, to give CNN an embarrassment for his stupid and ridiculous interview.
and, they have predicted that you will say that the spontaneous vote is paid by of gov, or made by hackers, as you always do when you distort the truth which you totally have no idea of.
If we opposite our gov, we will overthrow it ourselves. if we need other countries' help, we will say it through our own mouth.
NON OF AMARICA‘S BUSINESS!
AND, IT IS UDERSTANDABLE THAT YOU DON'T AGREE WITH OUR GOV.
BUT GOV IS DEFFERENT FROM COUNTRY NOR PEOPLE.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU CAN MAKE DECISION FOR OUR SOVEREIGNTY AND DOMAIN!
SEE WHAT YOU HAVE DONE TO IRAQ AND AFGHAN!
CHINA WILL NOT BE THEM!


DQ   February 24th, 2010 9:27 pm ET

@Theresa

Ironically, even those leaders of the Tiananmen students who are in us now DO BELIEVE Xinjiang and Xizang are part of China.
Dont underestimate the IQ of the young generation-they know the truth of 1989 and they dont like the gov't. But Tibet affair is over that.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 9:27 pm ET

@ Gerald Jolly February 24th, 2010 8:07 pm ET

Thankyou for this. Just as well, as I thought Dodie could be a he, just going by the name. Sorry Dodie, I hope you forgive me.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 9:30 pm ET

@ Shi February 24th, 2010 9:23 pm ET

Good comment.


A. Smith, Oregon   February 24th, 2010 9:37 pm ET

China's national sentiment is no different than some of the right wing American national sentiment that is strongly pushing America into Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran and Yemen in its relentless push for Military bases and conflicts across the middle east and around the world.

America should and needs to get out of the Middle East as much as possible. Rebuild and repair America's aging infra-structure and help feed its large homeless population, restore the health and care of all of its citizens, not just the small percentage that have enough personal fortunes left in their bank accounts to pay the hyper-costs of Western Medical care and treatment.

Yes, America has its problems, concerns and critical needs to address within her own borders.

When China is unable to feed its own people, they'll turn on China's Govt. and the conquest of Tibet will not seem important nor even prudent to continue down that path.

Tibetan Independence, Free Tibet


Shi   February 24th, 2010 9:39 pm ET

@ A. Smith, Oregon
sorry for i don't know the chinese meaning of "'non-official Chinese State line" for my english is not good enough.
i don't know what is the gov's attitude on Tiananmen issue. i was born after that. but, the youth of my age, who born after it, and if they care about the politics, we do know there are thousands of innocent students killed. the news is not totally blockaded. and people talk sometimes about it in blogs.
the issue is a mistake mad by the gov. it is a failed uprising against communism, in fact the people at that time will accept the same gov, if the gov had declared to tranfered into capitalism.
however, the gov knew there are still huge amounts of communists in china, afraid of the whole country divided into parts like soviet, the gov choose to kill people prefer capitalism.
that's all the truth i know. and i will be glad to know more facts.
but, it's differen from tibet.
the wrongdoing of the gov doesn't mean that the country has to lose its domain.
we will build a more decromatic gov one day, with tibet on our national map.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 10:06 pm ET

I meant to post this on another blog, but it has gone, so will post here.

Taken from The Bible – Matthew Chapter 10, Verses 24 to 42 (Jesus Sends Out the Twelve Disciples)

24) -"A student is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master.
25) -It is enough for the student to be like his teacher, and the servant like his master. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebub (The Devil), how much more the members of his household.
26) -So do not be afraid of them. There is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, or hidden that will not be made known.
27) -What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs.
28) -Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
29) -Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father.
30) -And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered.
31) -So don't be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows.
32) -Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in heaven.
33) -But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.
34) -Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
35) -For I have come to turn – 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law –
36) -a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'
37) -Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;
38) -and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.
39) -Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.
40) -He who receives you receives me, and he who receives me receives the one who sent me.
41) -Anyone who receives a prophet because he is a prophet will receive a prophet's reward, and anyone who receives a righteous man because he is a righteous man will receive a righteous man's reward.
42) -And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is my disciple, I tell you the truth, he will certainly not lose his reward."


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 10:25 pm ET

@ Pasang February 24th, 2010 3:40 pm ET

Very well written. Does send shivers.


Zhou   February 24th, 2010 10:28 pm ET

DEMOCRACY IN CHINA !


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 10:34 pm ET

@ Tibet, Tibet, Tibet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! February 24th, 2010 5:30 pm ET

Your words wanted to make me cry.


Jessie from Auckland, NZ   February 24th, 2010 10:43 pm ET

Thankyou moderators for removing that comment before.


Shi   February 24th, 2010 11:03 pm ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
in fact, China's national sentiment is different from the right wing American national sentiment it is the left wing China's national sentiment no different than your right wing. the left wing in china believe that our chairman should have a meeting with Osama bin Laden as you do to Dalai Lama.
and the right wing in china think that china is not decromatic and the gov is not on behalf of people. but they never say that tibet is not a part of china.
and for the pollution. i seldom read local or national news ( as it's not as funny as news in western country, politicians from different parties criticizing on each other like dogs barking), but the medium do make critism on the factories making pollution and the drawback of the gov's systems for that they have not prevented it.
in fact, the left wing believe that it is the over-given freedom and encouragement for people to make fortunate on their own that cause the pollution.
of course i don't agree with the idea.
but what you don't know is that chinese people don't realize the importance of protecting environment as early as westerners. we didn't realize it until the 21st century.but now we know we have made some mistakes during the process of developing economics. that's why we are making up for it now.
as tibet has not been developed, we will not do wrong things again in tibet.
PS: R U PROUD OF UR BEAYTIFUL AND ENVIRONMENT IN US? IT IS BECAUSE THE POLLUTION AND LANDFILL U MAKE R IN OUR COUNTRY!


Shi   February 24th, 2010 11:04 pm ET

@ JESSIE
thanks


q   February 24th, 2010 11:05 pm ET

@Shi

"the wrongdoing of the gov doesn't mean that the country has to lose its domain.
we will build a more decromatic gov one day, with tibet on our national map."

Well said. No concession can be made when it comes to sovereignty. CCP is probably the worst government on earth but that doesn't mean we will not stand by her in national security issues. It is in our best interest to transform our country to a modern and fair society. By the same token, we will not tolerate any attempts to split our motherland.


Shi   February 24th, 2010 11:14 pm ET

@A. Smith, Oregon
also, your tibetan friends are not tibetans live in today's china. their ancestors lose their power in tibet. so they move to america.
tibet is very poor, much poorer than south america. few of the tibetans are educated and can go abroad.
but i do know some tibetan live in tibet now. as you say, if chinese people ( here i mean Han people) are prescuing them, they will not be our friends. however, in fact, they make phone calls from tibet, saying that the supporters of Dalai Lama are killing Han people and other tibetans by biting or arsoning on the streets. they tell us not to go to tibet for it's unsafe now.
why they r so kind to their enemies?
because we r not enemies, we r family.


John H   February 24th, 2010 11:37 pm ET

It amazes me the amount of commentary this visit by the Dali Lama has generated. It seems to have broken down into a debate over whether China has rightfully taken possession of Tibet and it's people or whether China is acting the agressor here. It appears to me that China is only following a pattern set for them back in the 17th, 18th, and 19th centuries where the European Nations and we, The United States of America lived by the philosophy that we were the superior world cultures and our destiny was to expand and occupy the lesser nations in order to bless them with our superior culture. We were doing them a favor after all, were'nt we, by replaceing their inferior systems of government with ours? Of course, it didn't hurt that we we're able to exploit their natural resources for the benefit of our wealth robber barons. What is it about "Manifest Destiny" that you don't understand? Once our majority European based populations had finished our unstoppable march from the Atlantic to the Pacific Oceans what more logical thing was there to do but continue our march to the west into the Pacific and onward into the Orient. We were not the only nation to believe we had an inherent right to force our will on lesser (in our minds) nations but we certainly did our part. Who was it that forced Japan to open up to the outside world? Who was it that went into the Phillipines and defeated it's Spanish occupiers under the guise of freeing the people their from their Spanish Occupiers? Who do you suppose it was that decided that the Japanese of all the Oriental Nations were the superior race there and destined to control the lesser nations of the Far East (China, Korea, Thailand, Laos, Vietnam, Cambodia and so on)? The Japanese learned that lesson well didn't they much to our regret (World War II). One of our most venerated presidents and one of four whose image is carved into a mountain in our Northwest (Theodore Roosevelt) was a devoted believer in the superiority of the Caucasian race and believed our destiny was to eventually come full circle around the globe and be the rightful inheritors of the world. And we still look at him as one of our most heroic and far sighted leaders. So, what is they say about people who live in glass houses? Now all of this is not to say that China is within it's rights to expand into surrounding and weaker nations. It is not! It just makes it so much harder for us to stand on our soap boxes and preach to others against that which is such a well recorded part of our own past history. So, as one of the Caucasian Race, who inherits the blood on my own hands, I still say that the right thing for the people of China to do is to return Tibet to it's own people and give them the right to govern themselves as they see fit. And for us, I will insist on the right of our people to play host to the Dali Lama's of the World understanding that by doing so, we cannot force the people of China to do what we feel is the right thing but at least to have spoken out for the rights of the Tibetan People to live their lives free of fear and domination.


Gerald Jolly   February 24th, 2010 11:59 pm ET

@ A. Smith Oregon.

Are you unable to read??

You continue suggesting that agents of the Chinese government are the ones blogging on this site.

GEEEEZZZZ! A. Smith, you and I both know that it is not true.

Why do you persist on insinuating that the central Government of China is involved with the blogging of this subject by using agents???

Your paranoia has now become obvious to every intelligent person on this blog.

As you say, I am now convinced that you must be an agent of the most Idiotic organization in the world "THE C.I.A."

Are you a clandestine agent of the C.I.A.???

Should we consider you as one of their "DRONES"


Gerald Jolly   February 25th, 2010 12:06 am ET

There is nothing more demeening than to be refered too as a stooge of the C.I.A.

The C.I.A. is a group of misfits that want to convince we Americans that they are needed for our National security.

Truly the biggest B.S. that has ever existed.

Did you know that most C.I.A. agents are incapable of making decisions on their own, and they are usually recruited from the ranks of the misfits and incapable members, of our arm forces.

Most intelligent people refer to them as "DREEBS"


A. Smith, Oregon   February 25th, 2010 12:18 am ET

To those unfamiliar with the Chinese State imposed speaking points:

Bit of background. "Harmonize" (和谐) is a popular China Net-speak for being censored (as it's done under the slogan of "constructing a harmonious society.")

When the talk goes to China is doing this to construct a harmonious society, YOU know what is being silently stated. Chinese people are being prevented from accessing non-State imposed information about the Dalai Lama. The heavy handed censors would certainly impose a heavy handed response to those here that are speaking up for the Tibetan people.

How many thousands of unarmed Chinese protesters were slaughtered in Tianemman Square?

Return Tibetan Independence, Free Tibet!


Gerald Jolly   February 25th, 2010 12:40 am ET

I shall never forget the day when a dear friend of mine, Yang Hu, was being investigated by a C.I.A. agent, that had suggested to him that if he agreed to submit to oral sex on him by the agent that the problem would go away.

TERRIBLE!!


Dhakten   February 25th, 2010 2:49 am ET

Tibet is quite different China like Culture, Tradition, Religious activity,Language,Customs and many thing.Tibet is an Independent before 1959. Tibet wil be Free one day. Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .Free Tibet .


Shi   February 25th, 2010 4:32 am ET

@ A. Smith Oregon
it is true that we don't have enough freedom on the internet, nor getting negative information about our gov.
however, haven't you realized that most people against your view are chinese students in US, who are able to access information about Dalai Lama.
In addition, a tibetan supporter for Dalai Lama living in US says so,’Independent or not, what i think the most important issue here is to have the very basic right every human should have.‘
and what Dalai Lama says is “我们要的不是独立,而是自治区(what we need is not independence, but autonomy)"
so y do u still insist on sth that even Dalai himself doesn't need?


A. Smith, Oregon   February 25th, 2010 5:53 am ET

@ Shi, The Dalai Lama is old and there are two groups in his camp. One which is older and sides with the greater autonomy which the Dalai Lama is seeking. The younger contingent wants full Independence.

What I want is Peace. That very difficult to find aspect of real Harmony which takes a great deal of strength and effort to achieve for a sizable length of time. Americans such as myself feel rather high-jacked when America is militarily flexing its muscles and shaking its fists at Iran and other country's in the Middle East, literally 1/2 around the world.

I'm certain the Tibetan people would like their lives to not be constantly watched by the Chinese secret police, being photographed as they enter a monastery as well as when they stop and speak with the monks. Then being repeatedly call to task over why, where, who and when. When people are badly treated, they will seldom if ever offer to help you.

If Chinese people such as yourself see the burning of the thousands of ancient Tibetan Monastery's, Temples and Shrines along with the murder of their monks and rape and murder of their nuns, as very horrible and bad, perhaps China is moving towards more acceptance of religious and spiritual values in the future?


Shi   February 25th, 2010 6:29 am ET

@ A. Smith, Oregon
firstly, though i have never seen photoes you described, i believe there must did happen violent conflicts between tibetans and governments, and tibetans died a lot in these conflicts.
i'm sorry for the dead people and wrongdoing of my gov. however, it can't change the fact that tibet is a part of china at least since 1911, 38 years before today's gov founding.
what we chinese people need to do is seeking for more decrmacy ,more freedom,and better ways to manage this country, instead of separating it into parts as you would like to see.
secondly, though our gov has different beliefs from many of its people(including christians, buddhists and muslims), it has never tarnished any religions in public. people are totally accepting the religions, though most of us are atheists.
two teachers of mine in the university are christians, and my auntie is a buddhist. my schoolmates living downstairs are muslims. on the internet, you would see that people show highly respect to poems written by the 6th Dalai Lama. i have even bought a book about him. in fact, i really want to be a buddhist, for my agreement with the creed in this religion. however, it's just hard for me to believe that there are gods existing in the world.
thirdly, i hope tibetans could have the right to show their salute to Dalai Lama as they just regard him as a living buddha, what seems forbidden nowadays .
however, i doubt that Dalai Lama is a qualified political leader. his status is believed to be given through oracle, and how could you believe that a theoratic country, like ancient britan, could be a decromatic country?


Michael   February 25th, 2010 12:13 pm ET

CNN and other major U.S. media are the most skillful, sophiscated and powerful propaganda machines in the world! Just read Smith and some other ignorant comments, you know how well and thoroughly a lot of Americans have been brainwashed! Such systematically brainwashing started from the time when they were old enough to watch TV. All they have read and heard about China since then are negative. All they have read and heard about DL since then are positive, absolutely no any different opinions! No wonder haveing good critical thinking skills, knowing foreign languages, being willing to listen to different viewpoints are so important in a global society. Too bad, a lot of Americans who comment here clearly lack all these characters. It's almost laughable when Smith guy talkes about "ancient history of Tibet", don't you know that so many countries' territories have changed since ancient time? Do you forget the place you live right now used to belong to the Native people? The history of Tibetan region under Chinese central government's administration (Yuan Dynasty) is much much longer than the whole U.S. history! If you want to re-write world map, fine, could you please set a good example to return the land to the Native people and leave U.S. first?


Michael   February 25th, 2010 12:40 pm ET

How many Americans know that the 14th Dalai Lama was not even born in Tibet? He was born in Qing Hai Province with a mixed Han-Tibet ethnicity!! The then Chinese National government (headed by Chiang Kai-shi and later went to Taiwan) and the Master Ban-Chuan found him. His father was a Han Chinese with the Han last name Zhao! The historic record cleary tells how he was decided to be the 14th Lama by the Kuomingtang central government and religeous leaders in Tibetan area.

一、当1935年5月,西藏地方噶厦政府摄政王热振活佛决定派格桑佛与凯墨色等三人,向“东方汉人地方”的青海境内寻找十三世达赖喇嘛的转世灵童之时,蒋介石委员长立即派人至青海严密监视藏方寻访人员的活动,保证寻访灵童不受藏传佛教派别争斗的影响。当经过两年的寻访,有了初步线索之际,蒋介石委员长立即责令时任行政院长孔祥熙正式向蒙藏委员会主任吴忠信发出指令:

“27年4月26日渝(藏)字第1379号呈,为达赖转世一案,请敕青海政府严密注意,并婉劝寻访人员,务将经过情形呈报政府,听候核办。

“另件均悉。已据情转电青海省政府遵照矣。仰即知照。

“此令。

院长
孔祥熙

中华民国27年5月1日”

二、在1937年冬天,当寻访转世灵童活动在青海塔尔寺附近发现小灵童时,时任国民党军事委员会西安行营主任蒋鼎文立即通过蒙藏委员会委员长吴忠信向蒋介石呈递报告:

“西藏拉萨当局于上年派设僧喇嘛格桑、克迈赛(即 凯墨色)索安旺堆等来青寻访达赖喇嘛,历时半载,于塔尔寺附近汉族赵某家中找出。据拉萨占卜及去岁班禅大师之探访,确系再生之达赖喇嘛。……恐将来迎还时发生阻碍,故至今严守秘密,以便秘密迎请返藏。……我中央为巩固边陲计,对此次达赖返藏,宜作必要之处置,或遣使随同赴藏,俾诸权贵,以德意施政;或令青海当局留达赖暂住在塔尔寺驻锡,再作留送之计。”

为此,蒋介石读过国民党西安行营主任蒋鼎文在核查小灵童的出身呈报,认定他是具有汉族血缘的人,其家庭全家姓赵的报告后,曾兴奋得搓着手连声自语:“天助我也,天助我也!西藏这下子到我手中了!”接着,蒋介石指示蒙藏委员会委员长吴忠信:要严密注意,防止西藏地方噶厦政府将小灵童拉木顿珠私密送进西藏拉萨,并对吴忠信说:“如果出了差错,我唯你是问!”。蒋介石还亲笔给蒙藏委员会委员长吴忠信拟定电报,作出指示:

“蒙藏委员会吴委员长勋鉴:

“……查达赖转世中土,关系中央与西藏前途至切,况掣签大典例须由中央驻藏大员监督主持,令藏方请中央护送返及藏边。……此事确系中央改善西藏关系之重要时机,不宜坐失。究应如何应付,适应机宜,即希核议办法具报为要。

中正 . 庚
. 侍秘
. 谕
. 印 ”

三、因当时的青海省主席马步芳为经费问题,不愿意派兵护送刚寻访认定为达赖喇嘛转世小灵童去拉萨,中国国民党中央政府蒋介石委员长在几经磋商后,命令军需署垫发护送转世灵童由青海赴拉萨的10万元护送费。并亲自拟电文将此决定电告吴忠信:

“蒙藏委员会吴委员长勋鉴:

“据青海马主席步芳来电称:灵儿定农历五月中旬由青海动身,职府遴派师长马元海为护送专员,应需路费及到藏交际各费约洋十万元,恭请饬发……等语。除复电照准,并饬由军需署先行如数垫发,拨汇兰州朱主席转交外,特转此照。关于护送灵儿应行准备诸事,及中央如何派员同行照料,统希迅即妥筹办理具报为要。

中正 . 皓 . 侍秘 . 谕 . 印 ”

四、当转世小灵童拉木顿珠(即现在的十四世达赖喇嘛)终于在青海马步芳派遣的马元海师长率领一个营的兵力护送到拉萨之后,蒋介石又专门派遣蒙藏委员会委员长吴忠信于1939年12月进藏,主持转世达赖小灵童拉木顿珠的坐床仪式。吴忠信到拉萨后,排除西藏地方噶厦政府各种利益集团的种种阻碍,亲自到转世小灵童拉木顿珠的居室,查验了灵童真实身份。随后,吴忠信向蒋介石电告了相关情况。当时,蒋介石正兼任国民政府行政院长,他为了避免小灵童拉木顿珠在坐床前夕的僧俗集团争斗中夜长梦多,立即批准小灵童拉木顿珠免予金瓶掣签,并签批颁布了小灵童拉木顿珠继任第十四世达赖喇嘛的册封政令。全文如下:

“行政院呈案:

“据蒙藏委员会吴忠信拉萨电称:据西藏摄政热振呼图克图来函略称,第十三世达赖喇嘛转世一案,迭经观海降神,及僧俗官员公认,青海觅得之灵童拉木顿珠种种神异,实系第十三世达赖喇嘛化身,应请免予掣签,并照旧制剃发受戒。兹拟择期夏历正月14日(即国历2月21日)举行坐床典礼,请转呈中央核夺,等情。忠信复查所述灵异各节,均属确实,拟请转呈国民政府颁布明令,特准以该灵童拉木顿珠继任第十四辈达赖喇嘛。并发给坐床大典经费四十万元,以示优异。等情。

“据此,当经提出本院第四五0次会议,决议:通过,转呈国民政府颁发明令。

“理合,呈请签核施行。谨呈。

“国民政府
行政院院长
蒋中正

“中华民国29年(1940年1月31日)”

有了国民政府行政院这份决议,并经蒋介石亲手签批颁布政令,拨发给第十四世达赖喇嘛坐床经费四十万银元,正在拉萨的中国国民政府蒙藏委员会委员长吴忠信于1940年2月22日,在布达拉宫为小灵童拉木顿珠举行了就任第十四世达赖喇嘛的隆重坐床典礼。

第十四世达赖喇嘛坐床以后,吴忠信等一行于1940年4月间离开拉萨,经由印度返回当时国民政府的抗战陪都重庆。随后,西藏地方噶厦政府援行清代旧制,派了扎萨阿旺坚赞来到重庆晋见中央政府,向国民中央政府“谢恩”。


A. Smith, Oregon   February 25th, 2010 4:49 pm ET

@ Shi, if all religious choices and spiritual teachings are destroyed or removed then a person is pushed if not forced into an atheistic belief.

If a person is given religious choices and the opportunity for spiritual teachings then choses his/her atheistic belief, that's up to him/her. However there is a large difference between forced and the freedom to chose.

The Creator is not found residing in Creation, he resides outside of the physical universe. The physical universe is very, very small compared to the immense outer-space surrounding it. Nonetheless, outer-space and the physical universe within it, are Creations.

Person's must at least be given the choices of a relationship with the Creator or not. Know what you are giving up or not furthering in order to make a real conscious decision.


Shi   February 26th, 2010 5:48 am ET

@ A. Smith, Oregon
it is true that our gov doesn't ecourage missionaries to assemble in the public,
but, the fact is that my christian teacher was trying hard to force us to believe in christ on the class. and i have met at least two missionaries in the last year in our campus. what i could do is telling them sorry and i am not interested in christ.
in my hometown, a major city in china. you would see the monks and nuns taking bus just like others. and on sunday nights and christmas eve, churches are filled with people both christians or not. in Shanghai, one of the biggest and most developed cities in china, you could find open job offers for monks, with higher salaries than most people, from Jinghai Temple, a temple with long history located in the centre of this city.
it is true that we were born and grow up in a education of materialism. however, people are not forced to be communists, and i have known several people who become buddhists or christians after their 40s. one of them is even a member of the china's communist party.
people could choose to be a believer, though it may be hard for some of them like me.


Shi   February 26th, 2010 6:07 am ET

and, the law forbiding assemble of missionaries is not just for them. communists will not allowed to assemble without the approval of gov. (and during my 20 years of life in china, i have only see two assemblies: one is by the university students for US's bomb at our emabassy in 1999, the other is by parents protesting the unfair in education system in 2008. even the remonstrace to japan, a country regarded among the peopke as a forever enemy of chinese since WW2, was banned in 2005,)

also, there many of the most popular movie stars in china are believers of tibetan buddhism. i have never seen any negative news about them.

it seems that being a buddhist, especially a tibetan one, is sth popular, just like what is happening among your hollywood stars. and it is no difference for the gov nor the atheists from watching korean tv series, nor western movies.

i believe what has happened to tibetan buddhism is exactly neither as what you have had heard about nor what i had. it must be a mixture.


Shi   February 26th, 2010 6:20 am ET

what i have forgetten to mention is that, it is easily to access websites preaching buddhism, both Tantric (the tibetan buddhism) and Zen, or Tao, a local religion believed to exist before christ. and it is easily to by books about buddhism in book stores. the only pity is that most bookstores don't sell bible. ( but they do sell books called 'stories in the bible' )
and the name of my middle school, which is carved in a monument at the gate of the school, is written by the president of China's Buddhism Association.
in addition, do you know that the mother of Mao, who you believed has consquered tibet, and of course he hasn't, is a pious buddhist? even biographies written by westerners, filled with critique on his personalities and policies, admit that he is always a filial son.


Shi   February 26th, 2010 6:20 am ET

what i have forgetten to mention is that, it is easily to access websites preaching buddhism, both Tantric (the tibetan buddhism) and Zen, or Tao, a local religion believed to exist before christ. and it is easily to buy books about buddhism in book stores. the only pity is that most bookstores don't sell bible. ( but they do sell books called 'stories in the bible' )
and the name of my middle school, which is carved in a monument at the gate of the school, is written by the president of China's Buddhism Association.
in addition, do you know that the mother of Mao, who you believed has consquered tibet, and of course he hasn't, is a pious buddhist? even biographies written by westerners, filled with critique on his personalities and policies, admit that he is always a filial son.


Fei   February 26th, 2010 3:55 pm ET

Michael: Stop this never ending MISINFORMATION to distract the world from the Reality of Tibet and the REALITY is that China invaded Tibet and is occupying Tibet !
Prior to 1949 there weren't any Chinese living in Tibet ! (ofcourse may be few hundreds for trade reason) but nothing like today !

Qinghai is AMDO ! it is a Tibetan Province !
China annexed it into Chinese province you are calling Qinghai similar to some part of Yunan and Sichuan, these both were/are Tibetan province called KHAM !


Shi   February 27th, 2010 3:45 am ET

@Fei
Then why don't you google the map of Republic of China? it is a domination founded in 1912 and still exists in Taiwan.
China could have changed his history, but obviously he couldn't change the history of a domination that oppose the present gov in mainland and pro-America.
on this map, tibet is not only a part of china, but also much smaller than today's land. the east part of tibet , with the west part of szechuan, belongs to a province called SIKANG, which has been deleted in 1955.


Lopsang   February 27th, 2010 4:35 pm ET

Long-Live-His Holliness-The Dalai-Lama* & His- Compassion,Wisdom*Humbleness, We need this in this day and Age of Insecurities & Ego & lies,especially by the CCP,
Gandhi had british but China is more dangerouse then Brits back then ,


Shi   February 27th, 2010 10:08 pm ET

@lopsang
i understand and accept that to tibetans, Dalai Lama is a god and is everything. anything he has said are oracles and creeds.
however, as an atheist, Dalai Lama is a common monk to me, who also has desirations and makes errors.
what i believe in, is truth and facts, and the wisdom of humen beings.


Dodie   February 27th, 2010 11:58 pm ET

@ Shi

You discuss China in exact terms. Thank you for the information

You stated: "people are totally accepting the religions, though most of us are atheists."

That is one of the areas I love about China. No one pushes a religion down your throat. You are free to choose without the treat of someone waving their finger at you saying you will go to hell if you do not believe in their religion. What a breath of fresh air in China. I have seen churches in all the major cities in china, so the christian religion is accepted. From an outsider living with a Chinese family, religion appears to be of choice if you want... and very accepted if you do not believe in anything. I really enjoy that freedom!

I would assume the incident at Tiananmen Square is the cause for no assembly. The memorial is very beautiful and deeply touching.

I have a question regarding Tibet:

If Tibet is a part of china... then why must all Chinese nationals obtain a visa before they can go there. The travel agent in China will not schedule a flight to Tibet before we showed proof of visas. I could understand as I am American, but everyone else was Chinese National.

Would googling the Map of China have the American slant? I would like to explore from both China and Tibet the written history and make comparisons. This conflict is between your people. We should not be involved.... However, for my own sake, I am curious.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 12:18 am ET

Is the CCP divided?

Part of the organization prefers the old traditions and the other part wants the wealth derived from capitalism? Because your country is developing a very strong middle class that is primarily business men and women, it seems like Capitalism is developing a strong hold on your country. This will ultimately make a division in your country and your government. Do you see this?


Jack   February 28th, 2010 12:47 am ET

What I wanna say is that "hav u guys ever learned Chinese history before?","how much do u know about the Tibet?","How much do u know about dalai lama?" if u don't just concentrate on ur own economy. Whether or not Tibet will be independent it's own business!!


Shi   February 28th, 2010 1:48 am ET

@Dodie
my mother has went to tibet in recent years, however, it seems that she never mentioned me about the visa.
also, i can't find any information about the visa you said. maybe the chinese you saw taiwanese. taiwanese have to own a visa to visit china mainland (including tibet), but people from china mainland (inclunding hongkong and Macao) don't need one.
the information above are provided by both tourists and agents. if a visa is necessary, they would have mentioned it.
i have went to Hongkong, which is a part of china, (i think no one would deny this), and i need to have a visa.
however, this visa is different from the visa to foreign countries. anyone who wants to own one could have it after the required procedures, and it is dealed with local clerks.
PS: visa are needed for different govs, i think. if tibet is consquered by china, as most americans think, why doesn't china's gov cancel such a significant evidence?


Shi   February 28th, 2010 2:05 am ET

@Dodie
In fact, most people in my country think that china is just a 'so-called' communist country. for the reform since 1979, many foreign communists living in china to seek the dream of communism believe that china has given up being a communist country.

and in fact, chairman Deng, who both caused the reform and the incident in Tiananmen, to my view, is not a communist privately. communism is a kind of idealism, but Deng is a pragmatist. he believes that the life quality of people is much more important than the belief of the gov.

however, china's gov is founded on the belief of communism. gov needs people to believe that they are the right regime. that's why students have to learn lessons about communism. however, no matter the students, or the teachers, or the universities, or even the department of education, are paying the least attention to such courses.
it is just like, when a christian needs food and clothes, what he thinks of first is certainly money, instead of God.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 2:45 am ET

@Dodie
i have also made comparisions of both statements.
what i believe is that, china's gov has exaggerate the length tibet belonging to china. according to china's gov, it is longer than 600 years. but i believe that it is about 473 years from 1246 to 1368, and from 1659 to 2010. the map of china is provided by the minneapolis institution of arts. since the conflict between china's gov and dalai lama is not one between jusitice and evil, nor freedom and autocracy, but a conflict of power and benefits, i think the facts provided by a non-political third-part is the most objective.
china's gov says that they liberate tibet in peace. but there were intense battles in tibet, mentioned in a chinese novel about tibet. however, the battle is not between chinese and tibetans, but the two govs in tibet: CCP and KMT. and the CCP seize tibet from the hands of KMT.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 2:49 am ET

@Dodie
sorry for the mistake above, it should be two govs of china, and happened in tibet.
however, the fact is that : tibet has been a part of china since 1659.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 2:50 am ET

@Dodie
sorry for the mistake above, it should be two govs of china, and happened in tibet.
however, the fact is that : tibet is a part of china in history.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 3:13 am ET

@ Jack

This is not about wanting to "poke my nose" in your business. For me, it is grasping and understanding of what is happening between China and Tibet. I prefer to hear from those who live in China and Tibet. I prefer not to gather my knowledge from our media. All countries slant their media to help keep the people in line so to say. I had not discussed independence. I have no strong opinions until I gather the facts. You are making a big leap where I am concerned! You are now just in the air... there is no ground under your feet!

You sound very angry! I suspect you are on the F-1 visa here in the US. I am very familiar with this privileged attitude!


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 3:29 am ET

@ Shi

Thank you for your quick response and willingness to explain your perceptions about your country! I very much appreciate it. The friend I traveled with is mainland Chinese. All my friends are mainland Chinese from Dalian. I am sure you know of Dalian. The airport at Lhasa checked everyone’s passport…..mainland China, American. It made no difference.

Shi: Until I can gather the facts and find the truth which usually is somewhere in the middle, I really do not have a strong opinion pertaining to China and Tibet. I hope to find some of this out later this year.

I agree with you, my experience is China is more Socialist than Communist. There is still the CCP, however, socialism is stronger. And now with the development of the middle class, your country is changing again.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 3:52 am ET

@ Shi
In my humble opinion, Americans are brainwashed to fear Communism. Just like many of your people do not like the US. It insures peace within a country. Communism is just a different philosophy. It is not a philosophy I subscribe to; however, I personally have nothing against it unless the people in power uses it to devastate their people. Every country in the world has a right to decide their government. I love democracy; however, I don’t feel the need to force it on anyone. It is interesting you mention Christianity… as I am not Christian nor religious. What happened between China and Tibet in 2008? A conflict took place. What was that all about?

I suspect the internet is threatening to your government. The young people are all on the internet… probably even more than Americans. Your Internet bars are always full. Many families have their own computer and internet connection. This is truly the information age.

What is your course of study at the University? Your English is excellent! One of the best I have ever seen.

Again Shi, thank you for all the information you have provided


Shi   February 28th, 2010 6:01 am ET

@Dodie
it's my pleaure to explain about the culture differences between two countries. and thank you for your friendship showed.

about conflict happened in 2008, it is a tragedy to chinese. it is said that many tibetans (of course most of the tibetans r still friendly) go on the streets and attack people who look like chinese. they beat pedestrains to death, and set fires to the shops owned by chinese. also, they attack policemen that came later. and it seems that no police shoot back at them.
it is described by western tourists. they say that no westerners and tibetans are injured in this conflict. and the mobs will stop if a westerner tries to save the victim.
you can find news report on the websites of The Times, and Los Angeles Times has also reported that.

what we have heard is more horrible. however, i think the gov may have exaggerated it. so i just ignore it.

the gov thinks that dalai lama is responsible for the terrorism.(and it seems that it is true.)

the young people (including people study in the US, who r not controled by china's gov) find photoes on the internet that an American host praises the conflict as 'well done' when interviewing Dalai lama.what's more, american medias distort the truth with wrong descriptions. for example, there is a photo about nepalese police overwhelming tibetans, but it is said to be chinese.

that's why the youth today have a terrible impression about US. there was even a joke called 'don't be like CNN', which means 'don't lie and don't be mean'. also there is a website called 'antiCNN' (but i don't know who found it, the gov or people abroad).

until today, i can still see photoes and videos about how chinese abroad against Dalai Lama. it is moving to chinese(but of course not to americans).


Shi   February 28th, 2010 6:20 am ET

@Dodie
about communism: the truth is that even many young people in today's china against communism since they oppose the present gov.

however, like what you have mentioned, i think communism is just a philosophy. philosophy never hurts people. the shortcomings of the government is based on the defects of the one-party system and, of our enthic. the faults made by a pastor will never be the faults made by his religion.

about the internet: it is true that our gov is threatened. but i think it is unnecessary at all. like me, i have seen a lot of different perspectives about china, but that only helps me form a more objective view of the gov. it doesn't mean i have to overthrow it.( in fact, i think a violent uprising is the least effective way ). and we chinese believe that, if it needs a change, there will be a change; if there is no change, then the change will come sooner or later.

though many websites r sheilded by governments, people keep finding ways to login them. we have softwares that can easily escape from the test of gov.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 6:34 am ET

@Dodie
in addition, it's totally ok that u r neutral on the issue of tibet. even i don't know how to deal with it, though i believe that china hasn't invaded into an independent country.

in fact, i think it is understandable that most westerners support Dalai Lama, for most of u even have no idea where china is.(a british guy on twitter thought i am from south africa.) i'm just annoyed to those who r stubborn, brain-washed, and unlogical at all. (the so-called A Smith changes his lemma everytime and never response or confront my question and evidence)
and, no one could ever understand the tricks played by politicians.

PS: i really have no idea about the visa. and thanks a lot for your listening.
i'm studying art design, and thank you for the praise. i hope that one day i could study in the US.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 7:40 pm ET

Good Morning Shi

Again, thank you for the in depth explanations to my questions. I continue to be very impressed with your English language skill along with your willingness to help me “fill in the blanks” of my knowledge. Have you ever thought about entering politics? Your view, openness, knowledge and intelligence would give future hope for China. Your country will need more people like you.

I agree completely and I am amazed you were willing to discuss this. Yes, a one party government is definitely not optimal. Even a two party government as mine, can create a division in the country which is happening right now. I vote for a 3 party government; therefore, no one party is too powerful and seizes control. There would be more balance.

The one party government is inherent of many problems. They do not have opposite views in which to bounce ideas and give balance. A one party government does not have another party to challenge the procedures. Like a bank, they need checks and balances….opposing sides to view the situation. A one party government does not offer that. Thank you for bringing this to light!

Even in a two party government as the US, when one party becomes too powerful as with the Bush Administration, we lose our checks and balances; hence, we are in this mess now. The stability of a government must come from equal and opposing sides. That is the only way to achieve balance. This philosophy is taken from Taoism… I have studied Taiji for many years along with Qi Gong and learning the concepts of Taoism.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 8:11 pm ET

Shi

I would caution everyone in giving full credence to everything written and read on the internet. There are many people writing web sites spewing out propaganda. When reading articles, news, one must always take into consideration who is writing this, and even more important… who is paying that person to write it. CNN like all other media is backed by large corporate interests. If it was not for their money and backing, there would be no CNN. We would not have the opportunity to write here to each other. We have to take into consideration all networks whether supported by government as CCTV, or private industry. I do exactly what you do. What I hear in the news, I divide by 1/2 as the news is usually sensationalized in order to sell…. It is for this reason; I am middle ground between the China/Tibet issues. I do not want to base an opinion of this magnitude without facts….not just stated facts taken from the media.

Issues for China around Capitalism may be a huge problem for your country in the next 20 – 30 years. Because of our large corporations out-sourced to your country, your manufacturers realize how much money can be made. Everyone wants to live well… and for some, the desire to be wealthy financially could mean taking advantage of others. I have noticed that many items are built with the lowest cost; creating many problems for the consumer (buyer)

I will give you an example:
5 years ago, 2005, I purchased a couple of homes in Dalian, China. The developer is a business man and was able to lease a very large size of land from the government. He built many tall buildings for homes. He was not approved to sell international… only for mainland Chinese. The people I know in China, within their family, have very high ties in your government. I found these homes and wanted to purchase them. Because the developer was not approved for international buyers, my friend and his family was able to obtain qualifications from your government for the developer so I could purchase the homes. What I found is, he built the building as cheaply as possible; thus, insuring he would make more profits (money). I have had nothing but problems with this developer and the building. The homes are new. What I am saying is, with Capitalism, you also need checks and balances. If your country does not quickly put into place the checks and balances; the few who want to be very wealthy financially, will be at the expense of your people from China. Laws should be written as soon as possible in order to protect your people and placing responsibility of quality on the manufacturer or in my situation, the developer.


Dodie   February 28th, 2010 8:14 pm ET

@ Shi

I must admit, I find it extremely embarrassing that some Americans do not know where China is on the world map. I cringe every time I hear this.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 11:14 pm ET

@Dodie
i am interested in politics since i was young. but i have never thought of entering politics. it's just interesting to observe people cheating and working hard for power and benefits unsrupulously. and i am always foud of searching for the truth and analysing the situation. however, being a politician is too tiring for you have to be nervous and aggressive. also, i think though it looks simple sometime, it will be definitely difficult to deal with.
my grandpa, an old communist and also a gov officer, was prescued during the Culture Revolution(do you know about it?). he was revenged by other officers for his upright attitude to corruption. therefore, i am growing up in an family education that 'never ever touch politics, a monster not controled by one person'.

about the one-party system:
in my view, any stable regime was built on militarism. CCP defeated KMT, and american people have to fight with british for their independence. but there comes problem following: either there will be one winner, which leads to autocracy, or there will be several winners, which leads to division.
so i think what china needs, instead of uprising, is a division in the gov. i haven't do a research on american or british history, but this is what has exactly happened to taiwan. it will cost the least for there will be no war (or smaller ones) among people. but, it will take a long time, and i suppose it will not happened in at least 20 years before a new generation takes power of the country.young people in china, of my age, in their 20s, are more decromatic and softening on national politics.

what is different from US is that a politician meets much less press and competetion when runing for the chairman. i assume that in US, people who become presidents and politicians are those most ambitious. when they choose their jobs after graduation, they choose the noble ones like lawyer.
however, in china, the chairman is elected by the gov, instead of by people directly. and one's prestige is based mainly on his age and experience, rather than his charm and ability (this is a cultural difference). only people who has been working in the gov for a long time r likely to be politians. thus, most ambitious youth choose to be businessmen(which is more risky), and those who just want ordinary life will work for the gov for its stable salaries.
which means, those who working in the gov and r going to be the leaders in the future, r truthly those who care least about the politics.
i don't know whether it is good or not. but it seems that at least, these people will care less about their personal profit, and be more kind to their people.


Shi   February 28th, 2010 11:53 pm ET

@Dodie
about the manufacturers:
it's nice u have bought a house in Dalian for i have heard that it is a very beautiful city. however, it is embarrasing and i'm really ashamed for the manufacturers. there r many houses and other products in poor quality. though gov is trying to protect the consumers, but there r always scandals. some people believe that corruption has been a serious problem in our gov. and some time it is really hard to control it. if u have ever been a small town in china, u will find coke made by local workshops (which means, fake), even chinese urbanites will be surprised at so many fake products.

as younger people living a better life, more concerned to the quality and conscience, i hope they will pay more attention to the things they will manufact. but it seems hardly to change in a short time.

and, i have found an interesting phenomenon in china, which may explain the small improvement in our decromacy. in the primary school, my class will vote for 'the most omnipotent students'. there r about 5 quotas. and the lists seem seldom change during the 12 elections. students will vote for those who r most likely to win, such as those who get highest scores, have power in class, and most adorable. though we r told we can vote for anyone we want, only a few students (in fact, those who will surely win) will vote for themselves. also, students won't vote for their bestfriends who r not striking.
i don't whether it is the same in US, but it seems that chinese people r always thinking what is 'RIGHT' and 'SUPPOSED TO BE', and vote for the person who is 'RIGHT', but not who is most BENEFICIAL to themselves.
people have already known who will be the next chairman of china, though no one has ever told us, and, most people will vote for him even those who don't like him at all.
it is really scaring!
but no one can easily change it.

PS: i'm glad that u seem love china's culture a lot. and i wonder what is ur occupation? r u a scholar majored in asia?


Fei   March 1st, 2010 2:55 pm ET

It is embarassign to read all these comments from my these fellow Chinese.

Tibet business is up to Tibetan people.

Dalai Lama is their spiritual teacher.

It is their life.

It is their Country.

STOP REPEATING PARTY'S PITIFUL PROPAGANDA LIES !


xr   March 1st, 2010 8:17 pm ET

I strongly advice the people who support DALAI,and considering him as the spiritual leader of the Tibetan Buddhist religion should go to Tibet,and figure out what happen there . Maybe , your opinion would change then.

I do not believe that the people who have never been in Tibet,and never talked to the ordinary and innocent people there are qualified to make such judgements .


Dodie   March 3rd, 2010 6:42 am ET

@ Shi

You have such fortitude and clear vision. What would you like to do with your education? You see your government very clearly and realize what needs to take place. What events do you think would be beneficial to your country?

I know just a little about the Cultural Revolution in which Premier Mao launched sometime in 1966 a revolution aimed at a specific area of the communist party. It seemed that Mao wanted to restore capitalism as he knew it would create wealth for China. Is that correct? Please tell me more about this. I would like to learn more about this. I heard some of the party was persecuted after the revolution. I am sorry your grandfather experienced the trauma.

To create a 2 party system, you would need to have enough people angry at the current government; therefore, forcing a change. Change does not come easily. It comes after a lot of bloodshed. The people in power do not want to give up that power or control. Young people in China are motivated by living well, desiring a good education is an important factor and many people are becoming educated overseas. It seems within your government they do not want to bring in anyone new, again keeping power and control to only a select few. If a successor of premier Wen Jiabao is not good for China, than all the people in China must change that.

Do not be ashamed of the problems with manufacturing and building. It really has its base in capitalism… wanting more money. Your government will need to put in place necessary ways to stop this problem.

Knowledge is what makes for change. Stay fast with your education. Learn all that you can. You are on the correct path! I work for the American Government. I am a Psychologist. I have a masters educational level in Education and Philosophy along with a doctorate Ph.D. in Psychology!


Shi   March 5th, 2010 1:36 am ET

@Dodie
frankly, i feel it odd to talk about politics as a student majored in art design. in my imagination, an artist need to be emotional, and listens to his heart, while a polician have to be rational, and listens to his people. the rock music stars who interested in politics, in my opinion, is for their idealism and the unsatisfication of the world we r living. to be an artist, should pay more (maybe most) attention to peace, love, also humanality, what r all above politics and benefits.
what i want to do in my future life, is just being a successful designer, and able to transmit the good spirit of my enthic, to others, including some get the wrong impression of china. we do have beautiful culrure, though much of it is losing today.
i really don't know what to do with my government. youth today r angry of it, some r more objective, but it seems that no one is interested in ploting a huge revolution. this is a shortcoming of chinese: we r pessimisive, passive, and depend on destiny too much.
i don't think i am very ambitious on my own career, though i have expectation in it, and i want to have something to do with the changes gonna happen in the world. i admire those who r smart, powerful, and influential, but definitely i have never thought to be one of them. it is okay for me to be someone common, but happy.
maybe the best way is that marrying to a politian and help him with his business. in china we believe it is a duty of a wife. and it is what i'd like to do. O(∩_∩)O~

the culture revolution happened after Khrushchev took charge of the Soviet Union. he was an opponent of Stalin, who was respected by the CCP in that time. Mao wrongly thought that there would be someone like Khrushchev in china, and his authority would be threatened. the CCP would be threatened. as a leader of workers and farmers(who r poor and low-educated), he thought those borned in upper class and high educated were dangerous. school closed and students worked in the country, instead of learning in class. people borned in rich families r isolated. professores, writers, and other intellectuals r presecuted.
of coutse, some politicians grab the opputunity to revenge their enemies.
in today's history book, the CCP has admited that it was an error, and harmed china a lot. in the whole ten years, the education, science, culture and economics stopped developing.


Dodie   March 6th, 2010 8:16 pm ET

@Shi

Good Afternoon

Ah, you may be an artist; however you have Illuminati intellectual capacity. The heart can also see what the brain cannot. You evaluate through a process of deductive reasoning whereby you not only use your brain, but also your heart! I render that balance far beyond using just one or the other. I read your blogs before I asked you a question. I experience your competence at a very high level even though you many not actualize it yourself. I admire your candor. Your command of the English language is stellar!!!

Shi, you under estimate your capabilities. With gifts as yours, there comes responsibility. We have a saying in the US. Behind every famous and powerful man, there is a woman! :~) Thank you for educating me regarding the cultural revolution. I did not have the full conceptualization of events.

For the CCP to concede they made an error; is a magnitude of epic proportions. 10 years ago, this would not have happened. Through your young, angry and well educated population will come change. It is always the University students that initiate the transformation most likely through a revolution of some sorts. It will happen in China. I say within the next 5-8 years. Remember this conversation. Remember these words.

I have an old saying:
Your money, wealth, health, appearance can all be lost or taken away; however, your knowledge will guide you through life on the correct path. ~Dodie, 1995~


Shi   March 10th, 2010 3:35 am ET

@Dodie
Thank u very much of ur encouragement! u r really nice.
i hope that one day i could make contribution to the world, even though little, and all people's life will be much better. that is the meaning of our life, i think.
thanks again. it's such a impressive communication.


Hesser   March 17th, 2010 7:47 am ET

The World has witness about Dalai Lama and his people's peaceful solution for Tibet's problem with China. They have waited long enough than any other country in the world did by peace. If this moderate peaceful approach is neglected by China and the world, then don't BLAME Tibetans in future if Tibetans will have to take the violence actions. Peace doesn't make China enough Happy but One Man's Violence action made huge difference in the world that everyone knows by now. If 100 Tibetans take the path of OSAMA BIN LADEN, that time it is too late and don't BLAME to Tibetans. It could happen for sure if peace abandoned by the Chinese Government and the World Power. One time peaceful people might turn to the worst one and that time Tibetans will be regretted at all.


Hesser   March 17th, 2010 8:30 am ET

The World has witness about Dalai Lama and his people's peaceful solution for Tibet's problem with China. They have waited long enough than any other country in the world did by peace. If this moderate peaceful approach is neglected by China and the world, then don't BLAME Tibetans in future if Tibetans will have to take the violence actions. Peace doesn't make China enough Happy but One Man's Violence action made huge difference in the world that everyone knows by now. If 100 Tibetans take the path of OSAMA BIN LADEN, that time it is too late and don't BLAME to Tibetans. It could happen for sure if peace abandoned by the Chinese Government and the World Power. One time peaceful people might turn to the worst one and that time Tibetans will NOT be regretted at all.


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